Connecticut's Bold Move: Official Scientific UFO Investigation | Ft Rep. Joe Hoxha

0:16 Speaker 1: Siste.

1:25 Speaker 2: Welcome back to Total Disclosure. My name is Tay and

1:29 Speaker 2: I am so happy to be here today, coming at

1:33 Speaker 2: you Live from Boston. Today, we have a special show

1:37 Speaker 2: on Total Disclosure. We're joined today by Joe Hawksa, a

1:41 Speaker 2: state representative in Connecticut's General Assembly. He's a researcher and

1:46 Speaker 2: one of the first legislators in the country to push

1:50 Speaker 2: forward UAP focused legislation. He's born in a post communist

1:55 Speaker 2: Albania and raised in Bristol, Connecticut. Joe's journey SPAN's public

1:59 Speaker 2: service academia and a lifelong curiosity about the unknown sparks

2:04 Speaker 2: early on by shows like The X Files and In

2:07 Speaker 2: Search of Now. He's bringing that curiosity into the halls

2:11 Speaker 2: of government, introducing legislation to formally study the UAP phenomena

2:16 Speaker 2: at the state level. This is a conversation that the

2:19 Speaker 2: intersection of policy and the unknown. My favorite. Let's welcome

2:25 Speaker 2: Joe Hawksa. Is that right? Hot?

2:27 Speaker 3: Yes?

2:28 Speaker 2: I didn't even ask no.

2:30 Speaker 3: I was like, yeah, yeah, oh yeah, no, that's exactly

2:33 Speaker 3: how it's pronounced in the United States of America.

2:36 Speaker 2: Well, it's such a pleasure to have you have you

2:39 Speaker 2: here today. I guess first what most people want to

2:44 Speaker 2: know is why or how someone like you brought this

2:48 Speaker 2: kind of legislation. So maybe we'll just start at your

2:51 Speaker 2: origins and tell me how you kind of even got

2:54 Speaker 2: into thinking about this stuff.

2:56 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, great question, And yeah, it look like you said.

2:59 Speaker 3: You know, I've sort of had a lifelong curiosity about

3:03 Speaker 3: the topic. Uh, you know, any documentary, anything worth watching

3:09 Speaker 3: or reading I would always uh uh stay on top

3:12 Speaker 3: of and you know, make sure I watched the latest

3:14 Speaker 3: documentary or read, you know, the latest article or book

3:16 Speaker 3: that I could you know, that I could find on

3:18 Speaker 3: the topic. You know, and it's one of these things

3:20 Speaker 3: that for a lot of people, it's still very much

3:22 Speaker 3: so taboo, and I make it, you know, even like

3:25 Speaker 3: with the bill, I made sure to really keep the

3:28 Speaker 3: scope of you know, the the the bill and the

3:32 Speaker 3: intent of what we're trying to accomplish as narrow as

3:35 Speaker 3: possible because and even even though I did, the media

3:38 Speaker 3: still ran with it, and you know, put flying saucers

3:41 Speaker 3: above my head like I was gonna abducted by aliens.

3:44 Speaker 2: And exactly called me.

3:47 Speaker 3: You know, people on mine call me ufo Joe. They

3:51 Speaker 3: you know, I think that's taken. Yeah, you know, talk

3:56 Speaker 3: about Little Green Men, and there's no there's nothing about

3:59 Speaker 3: any of that in the bill. So I mean, I've

4:02 Speaker 3: always tried to The reason I bring that up is

4:04 Speaker 3: because I've always tried to make this pursuit as professional

4:08 Speaker 3: and as evidence based, science based as possible, and not

4:11 Speaker 3: about you know, hey, let's just you know, let our

4:14 Speaker 3: fantasies run wild here, and you know, it's it's never

4:18 Speaker 3: really you know, it's always been a very scientific based pursuit.

4:22 Speaker 3: But it was sparked by you said, you know, sort

4:25 Speaker 3: of fictional shows like The X Files. An intro of

4:29 Speaker 3: that show, you know, etched into my memory and it

4:33 Speaker 3: was such a cool show. And basically like the genesis

4:37 Speaker 3: of this curiosity started on a late summer morning. I

4:42 Speaker 3: was like seven or eight years old. It was summer vacation,

4:46 Speaker 3: and you know, I'm I'm I'm home alone. I think

4:49 Speaker 3: maybe my mom was grocery shopping or something like that.

4:52 Speaker 2: And back then we could be alone.

4:53 Speaker 3: Yes, exactly right, no babysitter.

4:56 Speaker 2: Mom was like, hey, I'm running out you.

4:58 Speaker 3: Good, Yeah, exactly exactly. And so you know, I'm just

5:03 Speaker 3: flipping through the channels, you know, trying to find someone

5:05 Speaker 3: to watch, you know, and I come across this show,

5:08 Speaker 3: and it happened to be that on that particular episode,

5:12 Speaker 3: they were discussing some UFO related phenomenon. I don't know

5:18 Speaker 3: if it was. I don't remember the details exactly. It

5:20 Speaker 3: might have been Roswell, it might have been you know,

5:22 Speaker 3: but I just remember seeing like a flying saucer in

5:25 Speaker 3: the picture and I was like, whoa this is This

5:28 Speaker 3: is really interesting? And why is this on the History Channel? Right?

5:32 Speaker 3: Like the History Channel talks about like presidents and wars

5:35 Speaker 3: and things that are facts, things that are real, right,

5:39 Speaker 3: Like I always told this, you know, aliens of UFOs.

5:41 Speaker 3: This is science fiction, you know, in the same category

5:44 Speaker 3: of you know, the Boogeyman and the tooth theory and

5:46 Speaker 3: you know, things like that. So why is you know

5:48 Speaker 3: this you know, credible program on this, you know, credible

5:53 Speaker 3: science history fact based channel.

5:56 Speaker 2: Uh you know back then again more history based. That

6:00 Speaker 2: is a good observation. Yeah, sorry to cut you.

6:03 Speaker 3: Off there, Yeah, yeah, no, And uh, you know I

6:05 Speaker 3: was kind of a bit a nerd really a large

6:08 Speaker 3: part of my life, but especially back then. You know,

6:11 Speaker 3: I loved reading about American history and you know, like

6:14 Speaker 3: like you said, you know, I wasn't born in this country.

6:16 Speaker 3: But I was, you know, pretty much raised your ninety

6:17 Speaker 3: nine percent of my life, and I always had like

6:21 Speaker 3: a deep appreciation for American history and American politics. So okay, yeah, so.

6:27 Speaker 2: You're watching you're watching this on the History Channel. Your

6:31 Speaker 2: mom's away. She already told you UFOs are part of

6:35 Speaker 2: myth fairy tale and you know, things that go things

6:39 Speaker 2: that just you know are legend. Right then you're seeing

6:41 Speaker 2: it on credible programming. What's I mean? Did you ask

6:46 Speaker 2: your mom like, hey, I thought you told me that

6:48 Speaker 2: was bullshit?

6:49 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly right. You know, I don't remember the exact details,

6:54 Speaker 3: but it was something like that, like it was like

6:56 Speaker 3: a you know, a question at some point, you know, like, hey,

6:59 Speaker 3: you know, I you know, I saw this like on TV.

7:00 Speaker 3: You thought you said it wasn't real, and you know,

7:02 Speaker 3: she kind of just brushed it off, like, oh, you know,

7:04 Speaker 3: did I say that? Okay? Whatever, you know, It's like,

7:06 Speaker 3: it's just it's what you know, that's it wasn't a

7:09 Speaker 3: big deal, you know what I mean? And for many

7:10 Speaker 3: people it still isn't. And and you know, part of

7:14 Speaker 3: what I'm trying to do with this legislation is trying

7:16 Speaker 3: to change that attitude, right, But yeah, I mean it

7:19 Speaker 3: was just like one of those things. It's like how

7:21 Speaker 3: we got bigger things to worry about, Like, what are

7:22 Speaker 3: you talking about?

7:23 Speaker 1: You know?

7:23 Speaker 3: UFOs?

7:24 Speaker 2: That is an interesting point too. It is because oftentimes

7:30 Speaker 2: we do we get ahead of ourselves and thinking this

7:36 Speaker 2: topic is number one, but there are actual issues going

7:41 Speaker 2: on with real like events like where you know, kids

7:45 Speaker 2: are getting blown up. You know, it's like, how does

7:48 Speaker 2: UFOs take precedent over something like what's happening in say

7:53 Speaker 2: Gaza or you know anywhere else? Right, how does that

7:57 Speaker 2: take And it's it's shouldn't, but it also shouldn't get

8:02 Speaker 2: left behind just because of that either, right. So there's

8:05 Speaker 2: this weird dichotomy, And there's honestly this weird dichotomy between

8:09 Speaker 2: your story and mine, the way your mother interacted with

8:12 Speaker 2: you and the way mine interacted with me, because when

8:15 Speaker 2: I saw what I saw, when I asked her about it,

8:18 Speaker 2: she was like, you saw UFO. She let me know.

8:21 Speaker 2: Early on, we didn't know all the answers, so you

8:24 Speaker 2: know what I mean. I grew up like, Okay, it's on, right,

8:29 Speaker 2: especially after I saw one myself, right, I was like,

8:33 Speaker 2: it's on. And then you know. So it's weird how

8:37 Speaker 2: our parents can really either open the aperture or close it.

8:42 Speaker 2: And I think and I think part of the problem

8:46 Speaker 2: and part of the solution now is the older generation

8:50 Speaker 2: versus the newer generation. The stigma's gone away. People like you,

8:54 Speaker 2: like myself, who are now in government, we're more open

8:59 Speaker 2: to it. Whereas the World War one guys, World War

9:02 Speaker 2: two guys, Yeah, it's not real, right, right, exactly, you're

9:07 Speaker 2: talking fairy tales exactly.

9:09 Speaker 3: Yeah, on the right line. Absolutely, And I think that's

9:12 Speaker 3: you know, the the general attitude with just you know,

9:17 Speaker 3: of that time period across many topics, right like, and

9:21 Speaker 3: you know, getting things to change requires a lot of effort,

9:25 Speaker 3: and most of the times it's not gonna The old

9:28 Speaker 3: guard isn't going to be the one to change its ways.

9:30 Speaker 3: It's a new sort of force or movement has to

9:33 Speaker 3: emerge to change the old. The old isn't going to

9:35 Speaker 3: change itself, so to speak, the old way of thinking

9:37 Speaker 3: is it isn't going to change itself, you know. It's

9:40 Speaker 3: it really takes you know, a new way of thinking,

9:44 Speaker 3: a new generation, uh to bring about that change. And yeah, no,

9:49 Speaker 3: it's it's really interesting because you know, and I've talked

9:51 Speaker 3: to like other people on you know, about this topic

9:54 Speaker 3: and of many different you know, generations, ages, you know,

9:59 Speaker 3: walks of life, and you know, ninety percent of the

10:01 Speaker 3: time it's like, oh yeah, you know, it's it's an

10:03 Speaker 3: interesting thing to discuss, but I've never had a personal

10:07 Speaker 3: experience or that, you know, you know, it's it's not

10:10 Speaker 3: like you said, there's so many other things, especially nowadays,

10:13 Speaker 3: competing for people's attention, you know, and quite frankly, just

10:17 Speaker 3: more existential, you know, more of you know, so many

10:21 Speaker 3: more things going on now that are of an existential

10:23 Speaker 3: nature than the UFO topic. But the UFO topic it's

10:29 Speaker 3: really hard to define. Like you know, we was talking

10:31 Speaker 3: to Gene earlier. It's it's so all and it's the

10:34 Speaker 3: we don't know what we don't know. And depending on

10:37 Speaker 3: how far the government is willing to explore this topic

10:41 Speaker 3: and dedicate resources to it, there's really no there's no limit.

10:46 Speaker 3: There's really no limit. And you know, it could it

10:49 Speaker 3: could be you know, we could be pursuing this and

10:52 Speaker 3: it hits a dead end, or you know, the government

10:56 Speaker 3: does make like a good faith effort to get to

10:59 Speaker 3: the bottom.

10:59 Speaker 2: Of this, they might not be a bottom.

11:01 Speaker 3: There might not be a bottom, right, right, And and

11:03 Speaker 3: that's the thing. But I'm but but here's the thing.

11:06 Speaker 3: They can create one and tell us that it is

11:09 Speaker 3: the bottom line, and we almost have like no choice

11:13 Speaker 3: but to like have to take their word for it, right, right,

11:17 Speaker 3: And the truth could be that there's more more to

11:21 Speaker 3: learn and more to see, but we'll never know, right.

11:24 Speaker 3: So I think when you add all that together, I

11:28 Speaker 3: think most most people's attitude, the average person's attitude is,

11:32 Speaker 3: like you just said, I'm paying a lot in taxes,

11:36 Speaker 3: I could barely afford to put groceries on the table.

11:39 Speaker 3: I'm having trouble paying my electric bill. You know, there's

11:42 Speaker 3: there's a war going on in Gaza, there's a war

11:44 Speaker 3: going on in Ukraine. There's a war going on in Iran. Like,

11:48 Speaker 3: there's a lot of stuff going on competing for people's attention.

11:51 Speaker 3: But does that does that mean that like the doctor,

11:54 Speaker 3: the medical doctor, because there's a war going on in

11:57 Speaker 3: God's Iran and Ukraine needs not to keep up on

12:01 Speaker 3: medical research? Does that mean right? Does that mean that

12:05 Speaker 3: the the rocket scientists because you know, because rocket technology

12:09 Speaker 3: is being used to to you know, basically project bombs,

12:15 Speaker 3: halfway across the world, that we need not continue to

12:18 Speaker 3: research rocket technology and propulsion technology and and transportation technology

12:24 Speaker 3: because it could be used for bad you know. Unfortunately,

12:28 Speaker 3: the world is always gonna have sucky situations. But we

12:32 Speaker 3: need to you know, care about those things and bring

12:35 Speaker 3: about positive change. But at the same time, we also

12:38 Speaker 3: need that little you know time that that that that

12:41 Speaker 3: time to uh kind of expand our horizons, you know,

12:49 Speaker 3: uh do something uh that progresses our society. And you

12:58 Speaker 3: know it's.

12:58 Speaker 2: Take a risk. Yeah, take a risk, get out on

13:01 Speaker 2: a limb, and taking risk is something especially in government.

13:06 Speaker 2: So to backtrack on that, because I don't want to

13:07 Speaker 2: go too far deep, what has been the response from

13:10 Speaker 2: your colleagues, because I know you said the media put

13:13 Speaker 2: UFOs over your head and stuff, as anyone like, what's

13:18 Speaker 2: been the general consensus of your colleagues, I would.

13:20 Speaker 3: Say majority supportive, But then again, even the ones that

13:27 Speaker 3: have actually supported the bill and even voted for the bill,

13:31 Speaker 3: you know, injected a little bit of humor into the

13:34 Speaker 3: into the topic, which I don't mind at all. I

13:36 Speaker 3: mean I don't I'm not somebody to take myself really seriously,

13:39 Speaker 3: and I take this topic seriously. But somebody injecting humor

13:43 Speaker 3: into it is not going to make it any less

13:45 Speaker 3: or you know, any less serious. But it's sort of like,

13:49 Speaker 3: you know, there was enough support on without you know,

13:54 Speaker 3: getting too you know political here. But obviously you know,

13:56 Speaker 3: as you know here in Massachusetts and similarly in Connecticut, Uh,

14:01 Speaker 3: there's one party that kind of dominates the political scene

14:04 Speaker 3: right now, and it's not the party I belonged to.

14:07 Speaker 3: So our our bills, you know, the bills proposed by

14:11 Speaker 3: the party I belonged to do not usually get taken up.

14:19 Speaker 3: Maybe some concepts can be incorporated into you know, the

14:21 Speaker 3: builds of the majority party, but our like standalone bills

14:26 Speaker 3: usually do not get taken up.

14:28 Speaker 2: And yeah, however, yeah, even at the national level, UAP

14:34 Speaker 2: seemed to be.

14:35 Speaker 3: Very bipartisans absolutely, so it passed. So it passed essentially

14:41 Speaker 3: when it when this had a public hearing, there was

14:43 Speaker 3: a few people that spoke in favor of it, nobody

14:45 Speaker 3: really spoke against it. And then when it came time

14:48 Speaker 3: to do a committee vote, you know that there was

14:50 Speaker 3: a couple of people that you know, spoke on the bill,

14:52 Speaker 3: and I was obviously one of them because it was

14:53 Speaker 3: my bill and you know, I had people that voted

14:55 Speaker 3: no within my own party. I had people that voted

14:57 Speaker 3: no in the you know, in the opposition party, and

15:01 Speaker 3: people have voted for it in my party. People have

15:03 Speaker 3: voted for it in the opposition party enough on both

15:06 Speaker 3: sides that it passed by a pretty good margin actually,

15:09 Speaker 3: And I would say that, you know, even the people

15:11 Speaker 3: that voted against it, they didn't vote it against it

15:13 Speaker 3: because they thought that it wasn't necessarily a topic, uh,

15:16 Speaker 3: not worth pursuing at some level. They just did an

15:19 Speaker 3: agree with the fact that, you know, we would have

15:21 Speaker 3: to pay for this study, and the budget is really

15:24 Speaker 3: tight right now in Connecticut, and you know, we have

15:26 Speaker 3: all sorts of issues with deficits and you know, surpluses

15:29 Speaker 3: and things like that, or lack of surpluses, I should say,

15:33 Speaker 3: and so every we're you know, we're trying to pinch

15:35 Speaker 3: as many pennies as possible here. So you know, a

15:37 Speaker 3: lot of people just viewed it as a as an

15:39 Speaker 3: economic thing and not worth.

15:41 Speaker 2: Right, going back to that point about this doesn't rank

15:44 Speaker 2: high enough on the list to pay for exactly. However

15:48 Speaker 2: it passes. Now, do you has anyone come up to

15:53 Speaker 2: you and you know, out of those who voted no,

15:56 Speaker 2: have you seen any inkling of hey, you shouldn't be

16:00 Speaker 2: dabbling with this stuff.

16:02 Speaker 3: No, No, not at all. As a matter of fact,

16:04 Speaker 3: the the the the exact opposite. There was a representative

16:09 Speaker 3: that covers an area where there's a military base that

16:13 Speaker 3: that supported the bill, co sponsored the bill, came up

16:16 Speaker 3: to me and said, you know, I've been looking to

16:18 Speaker 3: do something similar to this in the past, couldn't really

16:21 Speaker 3: quite find the right person on the other side of

16:23 Speaker 3: the aisle to like, you know, work with on this.

16:26 Speaker 3: And I'm I'm glad you you know, came forward, you know,

16:28 Speaker 3: on your own and and introduced something like this, and

16:32 Speaker 3: you know, uh, this is something definitely worth pursuing, even

16:36 Speaker 3: in its small scope. And uh yeah, I've had a

16:41 Speaker 3: lot of people, you know, support the concept absolutely.

16:44 Speaker 2: So quickly because you just oh man, you opened my

16:48 Speaker 2: mind there. Can you just summarize the bill? Yeah, and

16:53 Speaker 2: what it's going to do for what your what what

16:57 Speaker 2: is the action of it?

17:00 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, no, great question. So basically, so this bill

17:08 Speaker 3: ran through a Probes Appropriate the Appropriations Committee, which, for

17:11 Speaker 3: your listeners that aren't too political, essentially all that means

17:14 Speaker 3: is the committee that decides where the you know, money goes.

17:17 Speaker 3: So most bills start off in another committee first, and

17:22 Speaker 3: then we'll go to a probes because a bill could

17:25 Speaker 3: be could have something to do with transportation, it could

17:28 Speaker 3: have something to do with education, it could have something

17:30 Speaker 3: to do with housing, and it starts off as a

17:31 Speaker 3: concept and then we'll get referred over to appropriations to

17:35 Speaker 3: get a fiscal. No, it's called a fiscal basically just

17:37 Speaker 3: you know, it tells us how much this idea is

17:40 Speaker 3: going to cost. So, but mind went straight to appropriations,

17:43 Speaker 3: which was a really good sign because then there was

17:45 Speaker 3: one less hoop it needed to jump. And essentially the

17:48 Speaker 3: bill allocates something like three hundred thousand dollars to the

17:52 Speaker 3: connect to a big money, right, big bucks. Three hundred

17:57 Speaker 3: thousand dollars for the Connecticut Academy of Science and Engineering

18:03 Speaker 3: to basically conduct a study and form a committee to

18:06 Speaker 3: conduct this study. It originally was going to go to

18:10 Speaker 3: Yukon the University of Connecticut, and it got moved over

18:13 Speaker 3: to case the Connecticut Academy of Science and Engineering.

18:16 Speaker 2: Right, Do you think it's better suited there?

18:17 Speaker 3: Yes, it is, because they're very more you know science,

18:21 Speaker 3: a science based organization and they've done things of this

18:26 Speaker 3: scope before, you know, studies of scientific you know things,

18:30 Speaker 3: And so I ended up meeting with the guy that's

18:33 Speaker 3: you know, kind of going to be overseeing this and

18:35 Speaker 3: basically the money is going to be used, like I

18:38 Speaker 3: was telling you guys before, you know, to hire a

18:42 Speaker 3: very qualified scientist that will then form a committee around

18:47 Speaker 3: and uh, then we're going to put into place some

18:49 Speaker 3: sort of system to record any anomalous sightings, whether they're

18:55 Speaker 3: on earth, whether you know, meaning whether they're on the ground,

18:58 Speaker 3: water or sky.

19:00 Speaker 2: Uh.

19:01 Speaker 3: That's that's why the bill, you know, I think they

19:03 Speaker 3: called it UFOs, but it was supposed to be UAPs

19:06 Speaker 3: and identified anomalous phenomenon because as enthusiasts like myself and you,

19:11 Speaker 3: uh no, you know, these unidentified events could happen and

19:17 Speaker 3: water could happen on the ground, could happen in the sky.

19:20 Speaker 3: It's not just in the skies most people are used to.

19:24 Speaker 2: In fact, most of it's not. I would I would

19:27 Speaker 2: argue that most of it if you call it, if

19:31 Speaker 2: you if you were to label it a UFO, you

19:34 Speaker 2: would be limiting the scope of you know, what you

19:38 Speaker 2: what you're actually looking at. That's why I think arrow

19:41 Speaker 2: does label everything is we have no credible evidence of

19:45 Speaker 2: extra terrestrial Like why use that word specifically?

19:48 Speaker 3: Right?

19:49 Speaker 2: Because they what if they're a two dimensional then you're

19:52 Speaker 2: you're not lying, but you're not telling.

19:55 Speaker 3: The truth, right, right exactly?

19:56 Speaker 2: So I like what you did there with the land,

20:00 Speaker 2: air and sea. Yeah, you can't go into space because

20:03 Speaker 2: of no right, right, you can't go above eighty thousand.

20:08 Speaker 3: Case is all federal I guess owned by the federal government.

20:15 Speaker 2: But okay, so I gotta know what sparked this now.

20:22 Speaker 3: Yeah, so great question. So you know, you sort of

20:27 Speaker 3: got my my genesis story here with the whole X

20:30 Speaker 3: files and in search of with Leonard need moy and everything,

20:34 Speaker 3: and but now you know, I gotta tell you a

20:36 Speaker 3: little bit about this, you know, sort of the recent

20:39 Speaker 3: events that transpired that prompted me to finally say, you

20:43 Speaker 3: know what, I'm going to use my authority to try

20:45 Speaker 3: to shine some light on this subject. So in recent years,

20:49 Speaker 3: obviously we've seen you know, congressional testimony by people like

20:53 Speaker 3: David Grush, Lieutenant Colonel David Fraverer, you know, the whole

21:00 Speaker 3: Ryan Graves. Yeah, you know, so many credible people, uh,

21:05 Speaker 3: stepping forward and sharing their UAP stories and you don't

21:10 Speaker 3: have to take their word for it. They actually have footage.

21:13 Speaker 3: It's not just I, you know, was out in the

21:15 Speaker 3: middle of you know, the desert and I saw something

21:18 Speaker 3: and and oh it's like, oh, well, you're sure you

21:20 Speaker 3: weren't smoking anything, you know whatever. It's these are credible

21:23 Speaker 3: people on the job in uniform reporting these things. So

21:28 Speaker 3: you know that. It also even before that, you know,

21:32 Speaker 3: just you know, the topic was sort of simmering and

21:34 Speaker 3: now it's kind of blown up. You know, Trump is

21:38 Speaker 3: talking about it. You know, President of the United States

21:40 Speaker 3: is talking about it. Just yesterday he said something, you know,

21:43 Speaker 3: said that something you know, major was going to get

21:45 Speaker 3: delivered to the American people soon. You know, as far

21:47 Speaker 3: as you know information what that is, I mean, I

21:50 Speaker 3: don't you do.

21:52 Speaker 2: I think it's going to be the forty six videos

21:56 Speaker 2: that Rep. Luna requested from the d D O W

22:01 Speaker 2: Now Department or war. I'm Pete hag Seth because even

22:05 Speaker 2: going back and forth on that, So that's what I

22:07 Speaker 2: think is would beat Yeah. Yeah, So with all that movement,

22:13 Speaker 2: like you said, continue.

22:16 Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, no, no, no, no, no, thank you. Yeah, I mean,

22:19 Speaker 3: it could be that maybe it's something else. You never know.

22:21 Speaker 3: With Trump, he's always.

22:22 Speaker 2: A wild card, truly a wild card.

22:25 Speaker 3: And you know he's done some great things, you know,

22:27 Speaker 3: and I you know, supported him, but you know, I

22:29 Speaker 3: don't carte blanche support, you know, uh, anything and everything

22:33 Speaker 3: everyone says, you know, regardless of uh, you know, even

22:37 Speaker 3: if they're somebody within my own party. You know, I

22:39 Speaker 3: am you know, sort of look at things and assessed

22:44 Speaker 3: with my own eyes and years and my own brain,

22:46 Speaker 3: eyes and years. You know, I don't just go with what,

22:50 Speaker 3: you know, with what the party line is, as they

22:52 Speaker 3: say in politics, right exactly. Yeah, I try at least, yeah,

22:57 Speaker 3: and you know, but I'm this topic. I mean, he's

23:01 Speaker 3: done more than any other president has. And I give

23:03 Speaker 3: kudos to Obama too. I mean he broached the topic

23:05 Speaker 3: a little bit, you know, George Bush and Bill Clinton.

23:09 Speaker 3: I think we're asked about it and typical.

23:11 Speaker 2: Kind of even back to Jimmy Carter.

23:13 Speaker 3: Yeah, Jimmy Carter. Oh yeah, we know about Jimmy Carter.

23:15 Speaker 3: He reported to move on. Yeah, Siding Key had and

23:19 Speaker 3: and Ronald Reagan had one too when he was under

23:21 Speaker 3: of California. So it's like, I guys, if I'm crazy

23:25 Speaker 3: for putting up, you know, putting in a bill to

23:28 Speaker 3: study the subject. Then I guess Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan, Obama,

23:32 Speaker 3: George Bush, Bill Clinton, and Donald Trump, they're all crazy.

23:34 Speaker 2: Obama is funding a Betty and Barney Hill film.

23:38 Speaker 3: I heard about that Netflix like original Yeah.

23:40 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean you gotta ask, yeah, why why?

23:44 Speaker 3: Yeah?

23:45 Speaker 2: Right? Yeah, And you know it could be just like

23:48 Speaker 2: good you know, good old fashioned you know, venture capitalism

23:53 Speaker 2: and like getting into like new new things. Yeah, but

23:55 Speaker 2: there's also a big component to that story of the

23:58 Speaker 2: interracial ass Like, yes, that's Barney was heavily into the

24:04 Speaker 2: civil rights right, so I think I think he respects

24:08 Speaker 2: that part of their degree.

24:10 Speaker 3: And Obama has done I think, like a Netflix movie before.

24:13 Speaker 2: Yeah.

24:13 Speaker 3: Oddly enough he has like actually dabbled into the movie production.

24:17 Speaker 2: But regardless, again, regardless, And so you made a point

24:21 Speaker 2: earlier that I wanted to touch on, And it seems that

24:24 Speaker 2: when whether it's a president, a person like me, uh

24:30 Speaker 2: like Gene, a producer, or anyone, doesn't matter where you

24:33 Speaker 2: are in the world, when you have one of these sightings,

24:39 Speaker 2: it fundamentally alters you to a degree where you may

24:46 Speaker 2: have had a certain trajectory prior after the incident. This

24:52 Speaker 2: is the only topic I've ever seen that will change

24:55 Speaker 2: someone's life course. The rest of their life is dedicated

25:01 Speaker 2: to figuring out what that was. Yes, yeah, right, yeah,

25:05 Speaker 2: and it blows my mind.

25:07 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And you know, I was eventually going

25:12 Speaker 3: to bring this up, and I guess now would be

25:14 Speaker 3: a great opportunity to bring this up. That the sort

25:19 Speaker 3: of the fifty ton whatever elephant in the room when

25:25 Speaker 3: it comes to any of these discussions about UFOs and extraterrestrials, whatever,

25:31 Speaker 3: is well, if we discover that it is an extraterrestrial

25:39 Speaker 3: or non human intelligence behind these things, then what that's

25:45 Speaker 3: really what all of this boils down to. All the studies,

25:49 Speaker 3: all all the hearings, all the you know, the whole

25:53 Speaker 3: pursuit of this is to when we finally pull the

25:56 Speaker 3: you know, the veil off, and we find that we're

25:59 Speaker 3: truly out alone, then what then then, what it's like

26:03 Speaker 3: do people go crazy because of you know, strongly held

26:09 Speaker 3: religious or spiritual views that maybe humans as we know

26:12 Speaker 3: them earthlings were the only, uh, we're God's only creatures

26:16 Speaker 3: in the universe, which I don't believe in I don't

26:18 Speaker 3: think there's actually any evidence for that in any sort

26:21 Speaker 3: of Judeo Christian scripture either. But there's some people that

26:24 Speaker 3: do see the world that way, like uh, you know,

26:26 Speaker 3: like people would go crazy, right, And people that have

26:28 Speaker 3: had sightings on an individual basis, right, have like you said,

26:31 Speaker 3: been fundamentally changed for the rest of their lives because

26:34 Speaker 3: they've seen something or I've believed to see something that

26:37 Speaker 3: like they they're a human brain just couldn't handle. So

26:40 Speaker 3: that's why this topic is just infinitely interesting. And you know,

26:44 Speaker 3: with this bill, we're just pursuing a very very like

26:47 Speaker 3: you know, uh, a shaving off of the tip of

26:50 Speaker 3: the iceberg. Honestly, if you if you want to look

26:52 Speaker 3: at the potential of the whole topic, this what I'm

26:55 Speaker 3: doing is just a little shaving off the tip of

26:57 Speaker 3: the iceberg.

26:58 Speaker 2: Well you got to you gotta start cutting suff exactly right.

27:05 Speaker 2: So back to because I know where this I know

27:08 Speaker 2: where it's going. What what kicked this off? I kind

27:13 Speaker 2: of we kind of got off top, not off topic.

27:15 Speaker 2: I think that was great. Yeah, So what sparked this

27:19 Speaker 2: movement in you?

27:20 Speaker 3: Yeah, so you know, just like seeing this growing interest

27:26 Speaker 3: coming from the national level, and from uh scientists, you know,

27:31 Speaker 3: like you know we're talking. You know, I follow, you know,

27:33 Speaker 3: doctor Stephen Greer, I follow you know, like a v lobe.

27:38 Speaker 3: You know a lot of like these other people, and

27:39 Speaker 3: you know it's like we could all have, you know,

27:41 Speaker 3: our opinions on them, but I I try to follow

27:43 Speaker 3: as much as I can from everyone that's that's you know,

27:46 Speaker 3: has a level of credibility on this topic language. Yeah,

27:50 Speaker 3: And and it's like it's just becoming you know, you're

27:53 Speaker 3: seeing more documentaries pop up on like Prime Video, on Netflix,

27:56 Speaker 3: on you know TV shows. Obviously Ancient Aliens has been

27:59 Speaker 3: you know, on forever and you know, rip to Nick Pope,

28:02 Speaker 3: who you know sadly just passed away.

28:04 Speaker 2: I gotta give you credence, man, you know your stuff, Yeah,

28:07 Speaker 2: I know your stuff.

28:08 Speaker 3: Yeah.

28:08 Speaker 2: Yeah.

28:09 Speaker 3: Nick was Yeah, yeah, great guy. Yeah. And I saw

28:12 Speaker 3: him live once in Torrington, Connecticut.

28:14 Speaker 2: Actually I was at Contact in the Desert with him

28:17 Speaker 2: last year. Yeah, and I got to sit in a

28:20 Speaker 2: room with him for like thirty thirty minutes and we

28:22 Speaker 2: just just me and him talk really wow. Yeah, it

28:25 Speaker 2: was it was, it was, it was so ancient aliens. Yeah,

28:31 Speaker 2: that stuff, you know.

28:32 Speaker 3: So you know, ancient aliens again on the History Channel,

28:36 Speaker 3: you know, and the History Channel I think still has

28:39 Speaker 3: a decent amount of credibility. It depends on what you're watching, right,

28:43 Speaker 3: But like all these things are like real things, I think,

28:45 Speaker 3: you know sometimes you know, because since the advent, this

28:48 Speaker 3: is a totally different rabbit hole and topic we could

28:50 Speaker 3: get into. And I actually want to feel almost like

28:52 Speaker 3: just to you know, know, almost as much about as

28:55 Speaker 3: as UFO is actually maybe even more than the sole

28:57 Speaker 3: era of social media, right, content kind of gets garbled

29:01 Speaker 3: into this you know, new dimension known as social media,

29:06 Speaker 3: and because it's now called you know, social media content

29:09 Speaker 3: or Internet content that you know, it kind of gets

29:15 Speaker 3: lumped in with thing that things that are just like

29:18 Speaker 3: not have no use, you know, like brain rot and

29:21 Speaker 3: you know, all this other garbage that's on the Internet, right,

29:24 Speaker 3: And because it exists on that platform, it doesn't mean

29:27 Speaker 3: that it's that thing, right, Like we're talking about like

29:30 Speaker 3: you said, Betty and Barney Hill, that story has been

29:32 Speaker 3: around forever, but it only existed in the domain of

29:35 Speaker 3: print media, and you know sort of just this you know,

29:40 Speaker 3: oral retelling of the story. You know, there wasn't really

29:43 Speaker 3: like you know, like a center for the study of

29:49 Speaker 3: this phenomenon that happened to these people to like give

29:52 Speaker 3: it sort of that like academic level like stamp of

29:56 Speaker 3: like credibility, right, so, you know, as because it's not

30:02 Speaker 3: it hasn't been taken seriously. This topic hasn't been taken

30:04 Speaker 3: seriously to that level. These stories had to go somewhere

30:10 Speaker 3: and they went on.

30:11 Speaker 2: You know, the internet, national acchoir exactly, stuff.

30:14 Speaker 3: Like that, exactly. And it's unfortunate, right, And because of

30:19 Speaker 3: the way we're just wired as human beings, we associate things, right,

30:23 Speaker 3: So like if I saw this on Instagram, or if

30:26 Speaker 3: I saw this on you know, YouTube, or if I

30:28 Speaker 3: saw this on Alex Jones or something, it's.

30:30 Speaker 2: It's inherently less credible exactly, right, even though and but

30:35 Speaker 2: guess who's saying that.

30:37 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, right right.

30:38 Speaker 2: The ones who like who gave them the right. It's

30:41 Speaker 2: like you guys are playing pharmaceutical ads every every thirty seconds,

30:45 Speaker 2: I know where your allegiance.

30:47 Speaker 3: Is, right, come on, right, And I think more people

30:49 Speaker 3: are smartening up and they're seeing things for what they

30:52 Speaker 3: are and not pre judging things because of stupid you

30:56 Speaker 3: know things like that, like oh, you know, you know,

31:00 Speaker 3: it's funny. It's like, you know, you go you know,

31:03 Speaker 3: you go to the doctors, or you go to you know,

31:05 Speaker 3: some like professional right, or you go to your your

31:08 Speaker 3: banker or whatever, you know, somebody that holds a professional position, right,

31:12 Speaker 3: And I work in banking. You know, it's like my

31:14 Speaker 3: other job, Like I'm we don't make enough money to

31:16 Speaker 3: be full time politicians. We're only part time, so you

31:19 Speaker 3: gotta have another job, right, Yeah, that's a problem. Yeah. Yeah.

31:26 Speaker 3: So you know it's like you go to like, you know,

31:27 Speaker 3: the authorities. I guess that's the term. I was looking

31:29 Speaker 3: for the authorities, right, the professionals, the authorities about a

31:33 Speaker 3: particular topic. Like you go to your doctor and you

31:35 Speaker 3: talk about you know, like hey, I heard you know,

31:38 Speaker 3: maybe this diet is better than that diet or taking

31:41 Speaker 3: this supplements has like been shown to you know, to

31:45 Speaker 3: have this positive effect. And immediately these people in these

31:47 Speaker 3: positions of authority, they'll go, oh, or just see that

31:49 Speaker 3: on the internet. Yeah I did, and saying I saw

31:54 Speaker 3: that on the internet as a kid to saying yeah,

31:57 Speaker 3: I took out a book on that subject in the library.

32:00 Speaker 3: The internet isn't all bad, and it's not all junk.

32:02 Speaker 3: It's you got to judge things on a case by

32:04 Speaker 3: case basis. If I'm producing you a document that is

32:07 Speaker 3: a study that was published somewhere on the internet, it

32:10 Speaker 3: could have been from the official like government source, it

32:12 Speaker 3: could have been from like, you know, the National Health

32:16 Speaker 3: you know department or whatever. You know, it's like just

32:18 Speaker 3: because it's on the right. And I think, again, going

32:22 Speaker 3: back to that whole older generation thing, I think that

32:26 Speaker 3: it's tough, you know, with people that, especially with professionals

32:31 Speaker 3: in their respective fields, it's really tough for them to

32:36 Speaker 3: go against the grain of how their profession has taught

32:40 Speaker 3: them to think on a particular subject. It's really difficult.

32:44 Speaker 3: And there's a few people that are able to sort

32:46 Speaker 3: of unshackle themselves from that way of thinking and rise

32:50 Speaker 3: above it and welcome new information that comes in right,

32:54 Speaker 3: and use that information and judge it on its own

33:00 Speaker 3: merits instead of pre judging it from the lens of

33:04 Speaker 3: the previous paradigm that they were in.

33:06 Speaker 2: Right, do you think there's a problem in government where

33:10 Speaker 2: maybe some of the older generational people or even younger people,

33:15 Speaker 2: it's kind of taken off with that the younger generation

33:20 Speaker 2: now as well. But this really hardline religious belief where

33:25 Speaker 2: they think that we're dealing with angels and demons and

33:29 Speaker 2: we're invoking, inherently invoking demonic whatever, right just by dabbling

33:36 Speaker 2: in it. Do you think that that, even if it's

33:38 Speaker 2: not spoken out loud, do you think that that could

33:41 Speaker 2: be a problem.

33:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, I do, actually, and I think I've heard that

33:45 Speaker 3: a lot, and I've heard it from some younger people.

33:48 Speaker 3: I've also heard it from some older folks. I have

33:51 Speaker 3: a good friend who would probably be a great guest

33:54 Speaker 3: on this podcast actually recommend Yes, absolutely, I really want to.

33:58 Speaker 2: Talk to the person who's doing the study too.

33:59 Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah, that's yeah. I can definitely put you

34:01 Speaker 3: in touch with him. Oh yeah. And and part of

34:03 Speaker 3: what the study in Vaz is using that money to

34:05 Speaker 3: hire like a professor who's going to be doing this

34:07 Speaker 3: like full time. So we have we have some people

34:11 Speaker 3: on the shortlist, and I could run that shortlist value

34:14 Speaker 3: and see what you think of those people. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

34:18 Speaker 3: But you know, getting back to what I was saying,

34:20 Speaker 3: You know this this friend of mine, an older gentleman

34:22 Speaker 3: who has a military background, like like Genie here, and

34:25 Speaker 3: has worked in you know, intelligence and all that stuff.

34:28 Speaker 3: You know as he was, you know, actually a component

34:31 Speaker 3: of me, you know, finally, you know, sort of taking

34:39 Speaker 3: the step to bring this bill forward because of all

34:42 Speaker 3: the things that he told me that I couldn't believe

34:46 Speaker 3: we're true, but actually we're true. And so when so

34:50 Speaker 3: again it comes it comes down to people that are

34:53 Speaker 3: in positions of authority, right, or that were in positions

34:56 Speaker 3: of authority that we're part of the power structure, if

34:59 Speaker 3: there breaking off and they're saying, hey, what we've told

35:02 Speaker 3: you was not true, this is actually what happened, and

35:04 Speaker 3: this is actually how it worked. Uh that is I mean,

35:07 Speaker 3: you can't get any more credible than that, right, You

35:09 Speaker 3: can't get any closer to the source than somebody that

35:12 Speaker 3: was a part of the source telling you that what

35:14 Speaker 3: you're seeing on TV or what we've told you is

35:16 Speaker 3: not true.

35:17 Speaker 2: I agree.

35:18 Speaker 3: So that could have, you know, sparked more motivation and

35:22 Speaker 3: just more of a desire to bring this topic to

35:25 Speaker 3: use my capacity as an elected official to yeah I hear. Yeah,

35:31 Speaker 3: definitely an electric vehicle.

35:33 Speaker 2: I think it's a literal uf O.

35:34 Speaker 3: I love the sound those vehicles make.

35:36 Speaker 2: Literal yeah, neighbor.

35:40 Speaker 3: Yeah, And so where I was going with that was

35:47 Speaker 3: remind me again. So we were talking about my friend who.

35:49 Speaker 2: So what sparked the you taking the next time?

35:53 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, so you know, seeing you know how all

35:58 Speaker 3: these things are coming to uh you know, uh being

36:02 Speaker 3: brought into the mainstream and really important people in government

36:06 Speaker 3: are discussing these things. I said, look, it's now or never.

36:09 Speaker 3: This is this is the time for me to really,

36:13 Speaker 3: you know, use my my position, my tiny little position

36:16 Speaker 3: of authority here might but one that offers me a

36:19 Speaker 3: platform two to bring this subject into the mainstream. And

36:24 Speaker 3: if and if it accomplishes nothing else other than allowing

36:30 Speaker 3: more people to come forward, more you know, uh, scientists,

36:35 Speaker 3: ex military people to hop on this bandwagon, if nothing else,

36:39 Speaker 3: if it only results in that, then it'll it'll have

36:42 Speaker 3: accomplished its mission.

36:43 Speaker 2: I agree. I agree. So you told me on the phone. Yeah,

36:51 Speaker 2: and I want to segue here. You were in New Jersey, Yeah,

36:56 Speaker 2: during the quote unquote New Jersey drone incursions.

37:02 Speaker 3: Yeah.

37:03 Speaker 2: Can you tell me what that was like and what

37:05 Speaker 2: you were seeing? Yeah, you know what you felt and

37:09 Speaker 2: what was what was the Yeah.

37:11 Speaker 3: So this was late mid to late November of two

37:17 Speaker 3: thousand and twenty four. I was taking a road trip actually,

37:21 Speaker 3: to Arizona. Funny enough, I actually don't like to fly.

37:26 Speaker 3: I'm very interested in unidentified flying objects, but I myself

37:30 Speaker 3: do not like to fly.

37:31 Speaker 2: You're not going to take a ride in the UFO.

37:33 Speaker 3: If one was offered to actually believe it or not

37:35 Speaker 3: have one. If one was offered to me, i'd probably

37:37 Speaker 3: I'd probably take Yeah, like I would probably, you know, Yeah,

37:41 Speaker 3: you don't like fly, yeah, exactly, But I don't like

37:43 Speaker 3: to fly in commercial airplanes UFOs. I'm fine with them.

37:48 Speaker 3: So anyway, I had to go to this conference and

37:51 Speaker 3: in Arizona. It wasn't a UFO conference, it was something

37:54 Speaker 3: unrelated and I had some time, I guess, you know whatever.

37:58 Speaker 3: It was like during like Thanksgiving. So I had a

38:01 Speaker 3: few days off from work, and so I drove to Arizona.

38:06 Speaker 3: It was like a two day trip. I'd love to drive,

38:08 Speaker 3: I don't. I could drive like sixteen hours NonStop. I

38:10 Speaker 3: don't mind it at all, especially if it's going somewhere

38:12 Speaker 3: new that I haven't seen before. That constant like stimulation

38:15 Speaker 3: of you know, seeing new new landscapes and new cities

38:18 Speaker 3: is enough to keep me awake. But so I'm driving

38:22 Speaker 3: through New Jersey and I left it around like three

38:24 Speaker 3: or four o'clock PM, and it's it's already like dark

38:27 Speaker 3: by then, you know, that time of year. So but

38:30 Speaker 3: I'm at the part now where it's like leaving New

38:32 Speaker 3: Jersey going into like Pennsylvania, but still sort of on

38:35 Speaker 3: the New Jersey side. And from that point and until

38:41 Speaker 3: I got to about halfway through Virginia, there was a

38:45 Speaker 3: stretch of highway where every five minutes there was the

38:51 Speaker 3: red and green like flashing indicative of a drone or

38:56 Speaker 3: that you know, that particular sort of flashing that is

38:58 Speaker 3: required by law to you know, to be to be

39:04 Speaker 3: on a drone. Every five minutes or so, there was

39:08 Speaker 3: like a new one sort of just like hanging about

39:10 Speaker 3: one hundred or two hundred feet above the highway, and

39:14 Speaker 3: then you know, you would drive by because it was

39:17 Speaker 3: literally just standing in place, it wasn't like moving, and

39:20 Speaker 3: then five minutes later another one would appear, and every

39:24 Speaker 3: five to ten minutes for like about two and a

39:25 Speaker 3: half hours from New Jersey to Virginia, rotating through. It's

39:29 Speaker 3: rotating through. And the funniest and craziest thing was that

39:33 Speaker 3: there was literally signs on this highway that said that

39:36 Speaker 3: there could be like low hanging craft or aerial photography happened.

39:41 Speaker 3: So I said, Okay, that's that's what it is.

39:44 Speaker 2: Yeah, were these signs that seemed like they were just

39:47 Speaker 2: put up?

39:47 Speaker 3: Or no, no, no, they were like yeah, it seemed like

39:50 Speaker 3: they were there. They were like newer signs. I actually

39:52 Speaker 3: thought that too. I was like, is this something that

39:54 Speaker 3: they just put up or has this been a fixture

39:56 Speaker 3: on this highway for a while, and leaning more towards

40:00 Speaker 3: the ladder that it was, you know, a permanent fixture

40:02 Speaker 3: on the highway. But I just found it like really strange, like, hey,

40:05 Speaker 3: there's these signs that are warning us, warning or letting

40:08 Speaker 3: us know that there is these craft. And well, actually

40:12 Speaker 3: that made that sort of alleviated some of my you know,

40:17 Speaker 3: anxiety about these things because I saw these signs and

40:20 Speaker 3: it explained potentially what these were. But then when I

40:24 Speaker 3: go when I get to like when I finally like

40:26 Speaker 3: stop for the night or the next day or whatever,

40:28 Speaker 3: and I'm get a chance to look through my phone

40:30 Speaker 3: and catch up on the news or whatever, this had

40:32 Speaker 3: like made the news that there was like drones all

40:35 Speaker 3: over like this part of New Jersey that I was

40:37 Speaker 3: literally driving through, and I could safely say that they

40:41 Speaker 3: appeared to be drones. Did they want UFOs? They weren't

40:44 Speaker 3: things that were unidentified by me. They looked like drones.

40:47 Speaker 3: I could sort of make out the shape of the

40:49 Speaker 3: actual craft, and also based off the lighting, they looked

40:52 Speaker 3: like drones. But why there was dozens of drones along

40:57 Speaker 3: that stretch of highway on that night, I cannot tell

40:59 Speaker 3: you for the life of me.

41:01 Speaker 2: Right, right, So you're and that's very interesting, you know,

41:05 Speaker 2: because I had I had a member of Congress tell me, now,

41:11 Speaker 2: I think it's kind of come out and like a

41:13 Speaker 2: company kind of took responsibility and was like, no, you know,

41:17 Speaker 2: that's our stuff. But there's not a lot of drones

41:22 Speaker 2: that can fly at night, you know, because you need

41:25 Speaker 2: a certain thermal Like there's no sense in flying a

41:30 Speaker 2: drone at night because a lot of them don't have

41:32 Speaker 2: like the right cameras, like you're blind in the sky.

41:36 Speaker 2: But apparently they have these radiation seeking drones, thermal drones, right,

41:43 Speaker 2: So that's what's up there. And I had a member

41:46 Speaker 2: of Congress tell me on a on an encryptied chat

41:50 Speaker 2: to not go there, because I was like, Hey, I

41:52 Speaker 2: want to go and I want to see these things

41:54 Speaker 2: and he was like, I wouldn't. He's like, I'm not

41:58 Speaker 2: convinced that there's not a dirty dirt, dirty nuke that

42:03 Speaker 2: they're like a bomb looking for that they were looking for.

42:05 Speaker 2: He's like, I don't know if it's war games or not,

42:08 Speaker 2: but he's like, I just wouldn't take the chance. And

42:11 Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't take the chance I wanted to.

42:14 Speaker 2: But it's odd, you know what it reminds me of

42:18 Speaker 2: because these things were breaching bases like Langley. They were

42:22 Speaker 2: breaching bases that you know, like right Pat and we'll

42:30 Speaker 2: get the right Pat and a few of them with

42:32 Speaker 2: the missing scientists and generals. I don't want to get

42:34 Speaker 2: into after the break, but there is how are these

42:41 Speaker 2: things a staying up for so long without you know,

42:49 Speaker 2: the size they were? It just none of it made sense.

42:53 Speaker 2: So a lot of people were saying, like, you know,

42:55 Speaker 2: there was a mix of UFOs and drones, and maybe

42:58 Speaker 2: the UFOs. The drones were there because of the UFOs,

43:00 Speaker 2: and you know that's how the UFO community spins every day. Yeah,

43:04 Speaker 2: but these things were also shutting down facilities like our

43:07 Speaker 2: sensitive facilities. So every drone I know of, you can't

43:13 Speaker 2: even cross into an airport without it shutting itself down, right, right,

43:17 Speaker 2: So who got who has that capability?

43:20 Speaker 3: Yeah, these were definitely special drones. They weren't, you know,

43:23 Speaker 3: And I kind of had that feeling, you know, just

43:27 Speaker 3: looking at them and the way that they were moving

43:29 Speaker 3: and the fact that they were sort of synchronized to

43:32 Speaker 3: like kind of take over rotate shifts every like ten

43:36 Speaker 3: minutes or so. That's almost kind of like what it

43:38 Speaker 3: felt like, because you would see one and it was

43:40 Speaker 3: about you know, maybe like a couple miles away or whatever,

43:43 Speaker 3: five hundred yards a couple of miles away, like you

43:45 Speaker 3: would see it as you would get closer, like it

43:47 Speaker 3: wasn't moving, because it would get bigger if it was

43:49 Speaker 3: moving the way or closer to you would either get

43:51 Speaker 3: bigger really faster, you continue to stay small in your

43:54 Speaker 3: sort of field of vision. But it was just hover

43:56 Speaker 3: there and it was about two hundred three hundred feet

43:58 Speaker 3: above ground, and there was a sign that said aerial photography.

44:03 Speaker 3: Maybe it's some sort of craft that's taking pictures of

44:05 Speaker 3: the highway or I.

44:06 Speaker 2: Don't know, right, your your your brains like yeah, yeah.

44:10 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah. But then it's like it would leave, it

44:13 Speaker 3: would just literally leave. It would be like it would

44:16 Speaker 3: just go and then like five minutes down the road,

44:19 Speaker 3: down the highway, there'd be another one in the same position,

44:23 Speaker 3: you know, just like sort of floating, you know, maybe

44:25 Speaker 3: not exactly staying still, but like you know, kind of current,

44:30 Speaker 3: like the current. Yeah. So it did that for like

44:32 Speaker 3: three hours, and that on the stretch a highway from

44:35 Speaker 3: New Jersey to Virginia.

44:37 Speaker 2: That's odd. I mean it's odd.

44:39 Speaker 3: Yeah, right.

44:40 Speaker 1: Uh.

44:40 Speaker 2: And then so that so that has to be something

44:45 Speaker 2: that at least because have you ever seen a UFO.

44:50 Speaker 3: I've never seen one. I know people that have. Actually

44:53 Speaker 3: a family member of mine just told me that she

44:54 Speaker 3: had seen one.

44:56 Speaker 2: Well, once he become the UFO.

44:57 Speaker 3: Guy, yeah, people start coming.

44:59 Speaker 2: Yeah, so they're going to feel a lot more comfortable

45:01 Speaker 2: with you going forward.

45:03 Speaker 3: Yeah, what's that?

45:05 Speaker 2: So you don't have to tell me her name what

45:08 Speaker 2: she is, but what did she tell you?

45:10 Speaker 3: So this was in a city in Connecticut and she

45:13 Speaker 3: saw a like classic like disc shape and she was

45:17 Speaker 3: with like another friend that like flew above their heads.

45:19 Speaker 3: When I say above their heads on I mean like

45:21 Speaker 3: right above their heads, but like you know, five six

45:23 Speaker 3: hundred feet above their heads, and that it just sort

45:26 Speaker 3: of like vanished, Like it didn't drift off into a direction,

45:31 Speaker 3: it just disappeared.

45:33 Speaker 2: Can you can you guys get me the the average

45:38 Speaker 2: count of UFO sidings in Connecticut? I think move on

45:41 Speaker 2: has it? Yeah, I want to know how many cases

45:44 Speaker 2: are reported there.

45:45 Speaker 3: Connecticut is high. It is high, right, that's part of

45:48 Speaker 3: you know, the the justification for the study is that

45:51 Speaker 3: Connecticut has some of the highest you know, UFO sidings

45:54 Speaker 3: per capita, and you know, don't we want like a

45:57 Speaker 3: central repository to collect this information and a sort of

46:00 Speaker 3: systemic scientific way to analyze it. I think so, especially

46:05 Speaker 3: for the discount discounted rate of two hundred and seventy

46:07 Speaker 3: five thousand US your connect A taxpayers.

46:12 Speaker 2: So oh man, so per month.

46:23 Speaker 3: It's a lot.

46:24 Speaker 2: That's actually that is a lot.

46:26 Speaker 3: Well, I mean we're right between Boston and New York.

46:27 Speaker 3: I mean, the two most arguably two of the most

46:30 Speaker 3: important cities in the country.

46:31 Speaker 2: Like, is there is there any bases in Connecticut that

46:36 Speaker 2: are noteworthy? Hey you brought one up?

46:41 Speaker 3: Yeah, Groton, Yeah, you got Grounton, Connecticut. You have the

46:44 Speaker 3: headquarters of raytheon down the street here.

46:47 Speaker 2: I'm sorry, the headquarters of Raytheons in Connecticut, no.

46:51 Speaker 3: No, no, in mass in mass yeah, yeah yeah. And

46:56 Speaker 3: Gronton's a nuclear basin right on the corner of Rhode

46:59 Speaker 3: Island and Connecticut there. And then of course, you know

47:02 Speaker 3: you have like anything that could come from the Hudson

47:04 Speaker 3: Valley in New York. That's a hot spot historically, Whitley Stream, Yeah.

47:08 Speaker 2: The whole, that whole.

47:12 Speaker 3: Uh yeah.

47:13 Speaker 2: During the eighties there was a huge wait, what do

47:17 Speaker 2: you think about abductions?

47:19 Speaker 3: So my view on that is I always defer to

47:23 Speaker 3: people that like have have talked to the alleged abductees

47:30 Speaker 3: and are privy to more information than I am. And

47:34 Speaker 3: I really like, like, I really like doctor Greer's UH

47:39 Speaker 3: answers to a lot of these questions, which is UH.

47:42 Speaker 3: And I firmly believe this because of conversations that I've

47:45 Speaker 3: had with people like Jean and my friend that I

47:47 Speaker 3: was referencing earlier, that the United States government has has

47:51 Speaker 3: capabilities that like the public will never know about.

47:54 Speaker 2: Can I stop you from the because you just just

47:57 Speaker 2: because I don't think this will be able to insert

47:59 Speaker 2: this and anywhere else? Yeah, do you hear about this

48:01 Speaker 2: ghost murmur thing?

48:03 Speaker 3: Ghost?

48:03 Speaker 2: What ghost murmur No with how they found that pilot

48:07 Speaker 2: that went down in Iran? No, they did. Can you

48:11 Speaker 2: guys bring this up the ghost murmur So? First off,

48:15 Speaker 2: whoever named it? Great job? Great job. So you know

48:21 Speaker 2: the pilot that went down in Iran?

48:23 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we recovered him, I think, right.

48:25 Speaker 2: You know how we did that, Well, the CIA has

48:28 Speaker 2: this technology where they can detect a heartbeat, and they

48:33 Speaker 2: did it from thirty nine point something miles out and

48:38 Speaker 2: he Now, mind you, you have to separate animals heart beats,

48:43 Speaker 2: everything that has a heartbeat, and they found this guy.

48:47 Speaker 2: Now again I think take it with a grain of salt,

48:50 Speaker 2: because whether we want to believe it or not, we

48:53 Speaker 2: are in wartime.

48:54 Speaker 3: Yeah, and when you want.

48:56 Speaker 2: To scare your enemy and to think and you have

48:57 Speaker 2: some fucking crazy yeah you know technology, uh you know

49:02 Speaker 2: you but could it be a half truth? But yeah,

49:05 Speaker 2: they detected this guy's heartbeat from forty almost forty miles

49:11 Speaker 2: out and he was in a crevice. And the first

49:15 Speaker 2: thing he said back that he sent back, according to

49:19 Speaker 2: Pete Eggzeth, who I'm not believing that this is what

49:23 Speaker 2: he said first was God is good. That's not my

49:27 Speaker 2: first message back. It's like get me the gout of here, right,

49:31 Speaker 2: get me out of here? Not God is good, So

49:34 Speaker 2: I think that maybe the third or fourth right, right, right,

49:37 Speaker 2: like once you're getting contact of God is right. But anyway,

49:43 Speaker 2: but yeah, yeah, I mean that's crazy. That's and if

49:50 Speaker 2: that's what they're telling us, we am right.

49:52 Speaker 3: Imagine what we actually have. Look, I have constituents who

49:58 Speaker 3: have come to me really hard with things like this

50:02 Speaker 3: because it's it's like they could be crazy. But what

50:07 Speaker 3: if they're not right? And I've had constituents that have

50:11 Speaker 3: come to me and have said, oh, I'm sorry, Yeah,

50:15 Speaker 3: it's just one. One constituent has come to me and

50:17 Speaker 3: has said that he believes he was being targeted by

50:20 Speaker 3: like a like a directed energy weapon, right, yes, and

50:25 Speaker 3: can everybody described so he described like this like nothing

50:32 Speaker 3: overtly physical, but that he would kind of here like

50:37 Speaker 3: in the middle of night, like clockwork. And again this

50:40 Speaker 3: is also something people that are suffering from you know,

50:43 Speaker 3: genuine and mental health issues could probably experience as well.

50:47 Speaker 3: But he was describing a sort of like metallic noise

50:50 Speaker 3: like uh, like nails like coming down on like your roof,

50:55 Speaker 3: and headaches associated with it. Every single you know, every

50:59 Speaker 3: other night or something not like late at night, like

51:02 Speaker 3: eight nine o'clock at night or something like that. Like

51:04 Speaker 3: most people are still up by then, you know, unless

51:07 Speaker 3: you have some like crazy job you're getting up at

51:08 Speaker 3: like four. Most people are still up and like pretty

51:10 Speaker 3: alert at like eight or nine o'clock. And at least

51:13 Speaker 3: I am, I mean alert, Yeah, exactly right, that's when

51:16 Speaker 3: a lot of people are most alert. And you know,

51:19 Speaker 3: and this person, it's like, you know, when you talk

51:22 Speaker 3: to him and he's not talking about this subject, he

51:24 Speaker 3: seems like pretty normal, like a little eccentric, you know,

51:28 Speaker 3: but like seems pretty normal. And I've been trying to

51:30 Speaker 3: help this guy out a lot, and I've actually helped

51:32 Speaker 3: him out my story. No, he didn't know. He didn't

51:35 Speaker 3: serve in the military.

51:36 Speaker 2: Military. Do you work on anything?

51:39 Speaker 3: To tell you? It's hard. It's hard to do. No,

51:43 Speaker 3: I know, I mean I would, I mean I would.

51:45 Speaker 3: I wish I knew more about him. I don't really

51:47 Speaker 3: know too much about his personal life. Maybe that's something

51:49 Speaker 3: I could ask him about. But he's like sort of

51:51 Speaker 3: like a musician type, you know, and like just.

51:55 Speaker 2: Not boxes me. Yeah, yeah, there's something about it. Yeah,

52:00 Speaker 2: the metallic sounds and there's other stuff too. Yeah, and

52:05 Speaker 2: then just you tend to see a lot of creative.

52:08 Speaker 3: Creative people, Yeah, people being.

52:09 Speaker 2: Associated with this interesting. So you know, i'd be interested

52:13 Speaker 2: to know what he did.

52:14 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And I'll talk to him. And you know,

52:16 Speaker 3: he's having a hard time, you know with that's crazy.

52:19 Speaker 2: No burning inside though, no like internal like like feels

52:23 Speaker 2: like his insides are. I'm not trying to lead you.

52:26 Speaker 3: I think describes a lot of like it's that sort

52:29 Speaker 3: of stuff in his head, like.

52:30 Speaker 2: Interesting like interesting stuff. I would implore you to look

52:33 Speaker 2: into something called Havana syndrome.

52:35 Speaker 3: That's what he described it as.

52:36 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but yeah, yeah, that's that's deep.

52:41 Speaker 3: So it's definitely something to look into. And I mean,

52:43 Speaker 3: I'm happy to do it for him, and I try

52:45 Speaker 3: to help him out as much as I can. But

52:48 Speaker 3: but I mean, anyhow, I mean, we were, you know,

52:49 Speaker 3: we were talking about you know, abductees and things like that,

52:52 Speaker 3: and that actually brought me to thinking about a point

52:54 Speaker 3: that I was trying to make earlier about the angels

52:55 Speaker 3: and demons, and the same individual that's you know, told

53:00 Speaker 3: me about things that you know, the government, nothing classified,

53:02 Speaker 3: just you know, things that he was privy to that

53:06 Speaker 3: you know now has become declassified, but that he knew

53:10 Speaker 3: four thirty forty years ago. But that individual believes he's

53:15 Speaker 3: a big Roman Catholic and he believes that UFOs could

53:18 Speaker 3: be like demons, right or you know sort of you know,

53:23 Speaker 3: spirits or something. And you know, I said to him, well,

53:26 Speaker 3: you know, Jim, his name's Jim. I said, maybe maybe

53:30 Speaker 3: some of it is right. And again going back to

53:31 Speaker 3: the Stephen doctor Stephen Greer thing, he says, eighty or

53:34 Speaker 3: ninety percent of the things that we see in the skies,

53:36 Speaker 3: you know, are probably man made. Ten to twenty percent

53:40 Speaker 3: are truly unidentified. Now in that ten to twenty percent category,

53:44 Speaker 3: maybe some of these things do have like an interdimensional

53:46 Speaker 3: or spiritual you know component, like in the way a

53:51 Speaker 3: traditional Roman Catholic or religious person understands the existence of

53:55 Speaker 3: these things via their scripture, and in that same categor

54:00 Speaker 3: where it could be true extraterrestrial presence. But I really

54:05 Speaker 3: do think that it just makes a lot of sense

54:07 Speaker 3: at eighty to ninety percent of like what we've seen

54:10 Speaker 3: in the skuys is probably just Raytheon and probably just

54:13 Speaker 3: Lockheed Martin or Northward Runman or some of these black projects,

54:17 Speaker 3: you know departments, black budget departments or whatever, you know,

54:20 Speaker 3: testing their you know.

54:23 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're their next gens, their next.

54:24 Speaker 3: Gens and things that may we may never see.

54:27 Speaker 2: And you know, it's crazy to me that we've got

54:30 Speaker 2: to this point where it's not even that we deny it.

54:34 Speaker 2: We're not even denying anymore. We just go, yeah, it's

54:37 Speaker 2: probably black but black budget tech. Yeah, right, that's the deferral.

54:42 Speaker 2: Yeah right, it's not.

54:43 Speaker 3: No, you're crazy, you're crazy, right, No, it's it's.

54:46 Speaker 2: It's like, no, that's when we got cooking with Darba.

54:49 Speaker 3: I don't totally agree. I think, you know, this would

54:53 Speaker 3: probably have been a better way to start this whole conversation, uh,

54:58 Speaker 3: you know, with which is that I think the Overton

55:02 Speaker 3: window has moved right, Like, these conversations are not starting

55:06 Speaker 3: from the point of the person that is reporting a

55:09 Speaker 3: UFO first having to prove they're not crazy and then

55:13 Speaker 3: having to prove that they actually saw what they have

55:14 Speaker 3: to saw. I think we've moved past to the point

55:17 Speaker 3: now where it's like, Okay, describe to me specifically what

55:20 Speaker 3: you saw, and I can tell you whether it's something

55:22 Speaker 3: that is probably connected to something humans are doing or

55:26 Speaker 3: something that is truly unidentified or unexplained, right, like.

55:28 Speaker 2: If it's a bead of lights in the sky, probably starlink.

55:32 Speaker 3: Exactly most starlink I've seen. And I thought I had

55:35 Speaker 3: my first UFO encounter. I was actually on a face

55:37 Speaker 3: it and I had no idea what starlink was. I

55:41 Speaker 3: was three or four years ago. I was on a

55:43 Speaker 3: ferry from Connecticut to Long Island and as we were

55:46 Speaker 3: coming back from the Long Island side to Connecticut. Uh,

55:50 Speaker 3: it was the middle of the night. I think it

55:51 Speaker 3: was like eight o'clock at night, and uh, it wasn't

55:55 Speaker 3: quite summer yet. I don't think or it might have

55:57 Speaker 3: been like fall. And because it was, it was very dark.

56:00 Speaker 3: It might've even been like later than eight o'clock. It

56:02 Speaker 3: was really dark. And you know, they were in the

56:05 Speaker 3: middle of the sound there and there's no light, so

56:07 Speaker 3: it's just like really dark. And I look up and

56:09 Speaker 3: I see you know, like these things almost like uh

56:13 Speaker 3: meteorites or you know, flying uh like comments or something

56:17 Speaker 3: you know, like things like almost like burning in like

56:19 Speaker 3: the the atmosphere. And I was like, holy crap, Like

56:23 Speaker 3: I see a UFO pe yeah, right, And then I

56:28 Speaker 3: like I see somebody else like looking at it. I'm like, dude,

56:30 Speaker 3: you see this and he's like he has like a

56:32 Speaker 3: head of like his headphones in, and like he takes

56:34 Speaker 3: off his headphones and he's like what. He's like, do

56:36 Speaker 3: you see this? And he's like, oh yeah, that's that's

56:39 Speaker 3: a starlink.

56:42 Speaker 2: Here's a good here's an interesting thing though, right, yeah,

56:45 Speaker 2: did you not feel a little like a ship, like

56:50 Speaker 2: you almost want to believe?

56:52 Speaker 3: Oh yeah?

56:53 Speaker 2: And he like almost crushes you, oh yeah, being like,

56:56 Speaker 2: oh no, that's us starlink because it's like you you're thinking,

57:01 Speaker 2: you're like, oh my god, this is great. Yeah, and

57:03 Speaker 2: then someone's like, dude, starling and you're like, oh yeah,

57:06 Speaker 2: it makes and it kind of takes the wind out

57:08 Speaker 2: of your sails.

57:08 Speaker 3: Oh yeah.

57:09 Speaker 2: So you can see why people when they do have

57:11 Speaker 2: these sightings, they get defensive when they get explained prosaically.

57:17 Speaker 2: So we do have that as a problem. But any

57:21 Speaker 2: good UFO investigator researcher, they know that ninety percent, and

57:27 Speaker 2: that's being generous if not ninety five percent can be

57:32 Speaker 2: explained prosaically. Yeah, the five percent, that's what needs further investigation.

57:37 Speaker 2: And I assume that that's what you guys are going

57:39 Speaker 2: to want to see absolutely, Now, what kind of sensors

57:41 Speaker 2: and stuff are you guys going to be putting cameras?

57:43 Speaker 2: Are you going to be using existing astronomy you know,

57:47 Speaker 2: I know you met with Mark D'Antonio front of the show.

57:50 Speaker 2: He's got his observatories.

57:52 Speaker 3: Yep in Arizona, which is really cool. So basically, the

57:56 Speaker 3: funds for the study are gonna really only be going

57:59 Speaker 3: to paying the director and a couple of people that

58:03 Speaker 3: he's gonna have to sort of subcontract with. And then

58:06 Speaker 3: I think, because this is being run through the State

58:08 Speaker 3: of Connecticut, any resources and any detection software or anything

58:13 Speaker 3: that is watching the skies via the State of Connecticut's network,

58:20 Speaker 3: I think will be made available to the committee at

58:22 Speaker 3: no charge. Traffic camps, stuff like that. Yeah, really, like

58:26 Speaker 3: I think anything that like this guy is going to

58:28 Speaker 3: need that like the State of Connecticut owns, I think

58:31 Speaker 3: will be made available, like you know, free of charge

58:34 Speaker 3: because it's intra yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, So anything obviously

58:39 Speaker 3: that would be federal, we'll try to get, you know,

58:42 Speaker 3: like free of charge, but like if there's a charge

58:44 Speaker 3: or if we can't get because it's classified.

58:46 Speaker 2: Or as be interesting to see what they push back on.

58:49 Speaker 3: Right right, and and well that's the thing that'll also

58:51 Speaker 3: let us know where your boundaries are, where.

58:54 Speaker 2: You're yeah yeah, yeah, for lack of yeah, and also

58:59 Speaker 2: show as you ah, where they draw the line, you know,

59:05 Speaker 2: like it's anyway, So are you Are you a religious person?

59:12 Speaker 2: You don't have to answer yeah, but like, do you

59:15 Speaker 2: believe in a creator?

59:17 Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I know, I think I do. And

59:21 Speaker 3: I think the best way I could answer that is

59:25 Speaker 3: there there was a guy that I follow who passed away.

59:28 Speaker 3: His name is Jordan Maxwell. Yeah, and I follow a

59:31 Speaker 3: lot of the work that he did. I'm not saying

59:34 Speaker 3: all of it was, you know, accurate or he was

59:36 Speaker 3: right about everything, but he had this one really really

59:39 Speaker 3: good quote that I love using, and he always said that,

59:43 Speaker 3: you know, he was just an ordinary man pursuing extraordinary knowledge.

59:46 Speaker 3: And he also had another really good quote on the

59:49 Speaker 3: religious side of things, which was that if you claim

59:53 Speaker 3: to know God, then you probably don't. So that's and

59:57 Speaker 3: that's where I stand. I think, you know, there a

1:00:00 Speaker 3: God exists, a creator exists, but me trying to understand

1:00:04 Speaker 3: what that is is is a futile endeavor. So I

1:00:10 Speaker 3: just appreciate what it produces and what it what it's

1:00:13 Speaker 3: you know, given to us. And this you know universe

1:00:17 Speaker 3: we live in and it's up to us to explore

1:00:18 Speaker 3: it and understand it better. But to understand why God

1:00:22 Speaker 3: did what he did and all that stuff is I

1:00:27 Speaker 3: think it's it's a futile pursuit. And you know, especially

1:00:32 Speaker 3: the way like you know, uh, organized religion kind of

1:00:38 Speaker 3: you know, creates this terrain where uh people, you know,

1:00:42 Speaker 3: they're pitting people against each other, Like I mean, I

1:00:45 Speaker 3: don't I don't consider myself like a Christian. Do I

1:00:47 Speaker 3: believe Jesus existed? Yeah, Jesus probably existed. Was Jesus divine

1:00:52 Speaker 3: in any way? Maybe? Maybe not? I don't know. I'm

1:00:55 Speaker 3: not ruling it out. I'm not don't have any evidence

1:00:57 Speaker 3: to show that he that he that you know, other

1:00:59 Speaker 3: than I witness is. And you know, things that are

1:01:01 Speaker 3: in the Bible, the Gospels and.

1:01:04 Speaker 2: Men and men can be flawed.

1:01:06 Speaker 3: They could be flawed, they could be tampered with, they

1:01:09 Speaker 3: could be corrupted.

1:01:10 Speaker 2: And we know the Council in Ico is they chose

1:01:14 Speaker 2: certain works and left others out. I mean, the Book

1:01:17 Speaker 2: of Enough, you know, Dead Sea Squirrel all that kind

1:01:20 Speaker 2: of stuff. So it's like it comes down to and

1:01:24 Speaker 2: that's why I think kind of an interesting caveat to

1:01:28 Speaker 2: this is while I do agree that the anthropic principle,

1:01:36 Speaker 2: you know, our universe, it's perfect, and it's so perfect

1:01:42 Speaker 2: for life, right that it seems from the micro to

1:01:46 Speaker 2: the macro intelligently designed. Right, So I'll give them that

1:01:52 Speaker 2: there is an intelligent design for sure. Like you look

1:01:55 Speaker 2: around and you just go, this can't be no reason.

1:01:58 Speaker 2: Like so when scientists, you know, talk about the Big

1:02:01 Speaker 2: Bang and then you know someone religious said God said

1:02:05 Speaker 2: let there be light, I say, you're saying the same thing,

1:02:08 Speaker 2: just do different lens. So when it comes to these

1:02:12 Speaker 2: UFOs or beings, are we just what they called angels

1:02:17 Speaker 2: and demons? Are we calling aliens right? Or extraterrestrial non

1:02:22 Speaker 2: human intelligence? I mean angels and demons by definition are

1:02:25 Speaker 2: non human intelligence. And an interesting case is the Virginia case.

1:02:31 Speaker 2: Gene and I actually took a trip down to not

1:02:33 Speaker 2: to Virginia, We're going, I have the connections to go,

1:02:37 Speaker 2: but we went to the National pres Club event. I

1:02:40 Speaker 2: spoke to some of the Carlos de SUSA, all them,

1:02:44 Speaker 2: and you know what stuck out to me, is this

1:02:46 Speaker 2: smell of sulfur? Because what is associated with demons? Red eyes,

1:02:53 Speaker 2: horns smelled like sulfur. Well, that sounds like you. If

1:02:57 Speaker 2: I saw that, I'd be like, that's a demon the right,

1:03:02 Speaker 2: So just again to me, I'm going I think what

1:03:06 Speaker 2: we're dealing with is this is not black and white.

1:03:09 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, for sure black and white. For sure, it's

1:03:11 Speaker 3: not black and white. And yeah, I'm very familiar with

1:03:15 Speaker 3: the Virginia case. I've seen I haven't seen the latest

1:03:18 Speaker 3: documentary on it by James James.

1:03:21 Speaker 2: Yeah what James Fox Fox, Yeah, I implore you too.

1:03:25 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I've seen other documentaries on it,

1:03:27 Speaker 3: and I've seen, you know, uh, like an older one

1:03:30 Speaker 3: where you know, there's footage from ninety six where there

1:03:34 Speaker 3: are people are being interviewed and they're talking about this

1:03:36 Speaker 3: thing like it's just like they're like you, these are

1:03:39 Speaker 3: like villagers, Like they're not paid actors. These are like

1:03:42 Speaker 3: people working at a hospital trying to make ends meet

1:03:44 Speaker 3: in like an impoverished area of Brazil. Like they're not

1:03:47 Speaker 3: You could see the blood and sweat on their face and.

1:03:49 Speaker 2: Then the then yeah, it's like this is real, man,

1:03:53 Speaker 2: what this the neurosurgeon. Yeah, I got we got to

1:03:57 Speaker 2: meet him. Oh yeah, okay, he worked on the beat.

1:04:01 Speaker 2: Like this guy has no reason to lie. He's still

1:04:04 Speaker 2: one of the most highly regarded neurosurgeons in that area.

1:04:11 Speaker 3: Yeah.

1:04:11 Speaker 2: Like this guy, he's got money, he's get you know,

1:04:15 Speaker 2: there's no benefit to him coming forward seemingly. So you know,

1:04:21 Speaker 2: that's where I start to ask. And again, you know,

1:04:23 Speaker 2: the new Jersey drone thing brought something up from me.

1:04:26 Speaker 2: And again you know, uh, are you familiar with like

1:04:30 Speaker 2: the the late sixties incursions of like Malmstrom and mine

1:04:34 Speaker 2: not where UFOs shut down news. Yes, yes, well I

1:04:38 Speaker 2: know those men personally, like Robert Sallas, Dave Shindeley. From them,

1:04:43 Speaker 2: I can introduce you sometimes for you to talk to them.

1:04:47 Speaker 2: But I walked Bob into a representative Mace's office and

1:04:53 Speaker 2: allowed him to brief her and then later on Burlssen.

1:04:56 Speaker 2: So no one in fifty years had been able to

1:04:58 Speaker 2: do that for him. And I did, you know, not

1:05:01 Speaker 2: tooting my own horn. But that's what I do. That's

1:05:04 Speaker 2: I don't that gives me, that's my purpose in this field.

1:05:08 Speaker 2: I know what my job is, right, But don't you

1:05:14 Speaker 2: think it's a little weird that craft have been routinely

1:05:19 Speaker 2: since the sixties, at a minimum, breaching our most sensitive facilities.

1:05:26 Speaker 2: And it's it's what not not on not on anyone's radar.

1:05:32 Speaker 3: Yeah it is. It's it's mind boggling, it really is,

1:05:37 Speaker 3: and it definitely is on someone's radar.

1:05:40 Speaker 2: And these guys are no joke. You know. They have

1:05:43 Speaker 2: to report when they take IV prof and they're on

1:05:45 Speaker 2: the the what is it, the personal yeah PRP, So

1:05:53 Speaker 2: they have to like report everything that they do psychologically

1:05:57 Speaker 2: all of that. So when those guys speak, I because

1:06:01 Speaker 2: I owe it to.

1:06:01 Speaker 3: Them and like, yeah, I know, I know exactly what

1:06:06 Speaker 3: you mean. Yeah, you're you're doing yourself at the service

1:06:08 Speaker 3: by not paying close attention to you know when when

1:06:11 Speaker 3: somebody like that speaks absolutely yeah, and I've come I've

1:06:15 Speaker 3: met people like that before.

1:06:16 Speaker 2: Is there a back to you know? So you you

1:06:22 Speaker 2: do believe that there's intelligent design in the anthropic principle? Again,

1:06:25 Speaker 2: our universe does seem you know, very very perfect, almost

1:06:29 Speaker 2: too perfect, like it was intelligently created. But there's this

1:06:36 Speaker 2: weird like what if we had you know, and again

1:06:40 Speaker 2: this is speculative, I suppose, But do you think that

1:06:44 Speaker 2: there may be a possibility that we find out that

1:06:49 Speaker 2: some of these beings maybe had a hand in our creation.

1:06:55 Speaker 3: Oh, that would be interesting.

1:06:57 Speaker 2: It's a tough, tough conversation, right.

1:06:59 Speaker 3: It's a tough conversation. And I don't know, I don't think.

1:07:04 Speaker 3: I don't know that I collectively will ever get to

1:07:06 Speaker 3: that point, because I think that would be too too

1:07:09 Speaker 3: hot for many people to handle.

1:07:12 Speaker 2: Would you be able to handle it?

1:07:14 Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, I think so, because I mean I kind

1:07:16 Speaker 3: of like already sort of believe that now, you know,

1:07:20 Speaker 3: I think that, like you know, it's sort of like

1:07:26 Speaker 3: I don't know if it was with you that I

1:07:29 Speaker 3: that I we used this analogia with Mark. I think

1:07:33 Speaker 3: it was with Mark when we had lunch the other day.

1:07:36 Speaker 3: That you know ants, right, like when you know, the

1:07:40 Speaker 3: proverbial kid with a magnifying glass trying, you know, burning

1:07:43 Speaker 3: the ants just for fun. You know, the ants don't

1:07:47 Speaker 3: necessarily know that there's somebody messing around with their lives

1:07:51 Speaker 3: for fun, using this you know, beam of heat to

1:07:55 Speaker 3: burn them. They just know that, oh shit, we're having this.

1:08:00 Speaker 3: We're getting burned here. We got to move out of

1:08:02 Speaker 3: the way, you know, just instinctively, I don't think ants

1:08:05 Speaker 3: have problem, yeah, move right, Like like an ant will know,

1:08:08 Speaker 3: Like if you put your finger next to an ant,

1:08:09 Speaker 3: like it'll sensor something there and it will go around.

1:08:11 Speaker 3: So that's some level of intelligence, right. So I think

1:08:16 Speaker 3: the way to like try to grapple with that scenario

1:08:21 Speaker 3: that you laid out was to think of it this way,

1:08:25 Speaker 3: Like we would probably react the same way the ants

1:08:29 Speaker 3: react when there's somebody trying to burn them with a

1:08:32 Speaker 3: magnifying glass, which is we would just be so caught

1:08:36 Speaker 3: up and the emotional state of what that sort of

1:08:39 Speaker 3: disclosure brings that, Like, I don't think we could ever

1:08:44 Speaker 3: get out of that headspace to collectively collectively. Obviously individuals might,

1:08:51 Speaker 3: there's some people that think this way now, but collectively

1:08:54 Speaker 3: I don't think we could handle it as a society

1:08:56 Speaker 3: to get out of like panic mode and to understanding mode.

1:09:02 Speaker 3: Right the same way. Ants will never get to that.

1:09:04 Speaker 3: They're just looking to get out of the way. They're

1:09:06 Speaker 3: never looking to go what's causing this? Right?

1:09:09 Speaker 2: You know, I'll take you one further before we take

1:09:13 Speaker 2: a break. We because I think it's more in line

1:09:19 Speaker 2: with something like this, right, because we didn't create ants, right,

1:09:23 Speaker 2: But I see the analogy that everyone uses that one,

1:09:26 Speaker 2: and I like it. I tried, because I do think

1:09:28 Speaker 2: the intelligence differential it's probably spot on, but I like

1:09:32 Speaker 2: I liking it to dogs. We took wolves that We

1:09:40 Speaker 2: took wolves, right, and we we altered their genetics because

1:09:47 Speaker 2: for our benefit, you know, not just because we won't

1:09:50 Speaker 2: need a friend. But the wolves that were that that

1:09:53 Speaker 2: followed early humans around with you know, and and picked

1:09:58 Speaker 2: up off their scraps. Oh the he and goes, well,

1:10:01 Speaker 2: you know, I could use you to alert if something

1:10:04 Speaker 2: comes into the area. Right. So then along the lines,

1:10:08 Speaker 2: then we have dogs. And now I have one sitting

1:10:10 Speaker 2: in the room with us, right right. I love him

1:10:14 Speaker 2: and I do anything for him, right anything. He is

1:10:19 Speaker 2: my world. He has saved me multiple times. Right. But

1:10:26 Speaker 2: I also some days feel bad for him because I'm like,

1:10:29 Speaker 2: you can't experience the way I experience. So I liken

1:10:33 Speaker 2: it to that where maybe these things came along they

1:10:38 Speaker 2: saw primates and they go, we can use you, yeah,

1:10:44 Speaker 2: alter the DNA, right, and then Homo sapien comes out

1:10:49 Speaker 2: of that, and that could explain why every other creature

1:10:52 Speaker 2: on this earth seems to benefit some sort of ecosystem.

1:10:56 Speaker 3: And we don't we.

1:10:58 Speaker 2: Shed our fur only to need pelts in the winter.

1:11:02 Speaker 2: We stood up only to have back problems, We get

1:11:05 Speaker 2: burned by the sun. Yeah, none of it makes sense.

1:11:08 Speaker 3: We're not natural, right, yeah, I think we are the aliens.

1:11:12 Speaker 2: Yeah, right, it it makes no sense. And and and

1:11:16 Speaker 2: the brain doubled cosmically overnight. The evidence is there.

1:11:21 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I totally agree with you. I've always that's

1:11:24 Speaker 3: been that. This is like an ongoing thought I have,

1:11:26 Speaker 3: which is like, we are so unnatural to our environment, you.

1:11:31 Speaker 2: Know, and we all we want to do is create, create, create.

1:11:34 Speaker 2: We could where's my phone?

1:11:36 Speaker 3: And why is nothing? And if we're really, if we

1:11:38 Speaker 3: really evolved from some sort of ape like creature, why

1:11:41 Speaker 3: is nothing else of all?

1:11:42 Speaker 2: Think this? You know right, you think this this phone? Right?

1:11:50 Speaker 2: We could stop right here. Yeah, we could stop innovating

1:11:53 Speaker 2: the phone right here.

1:11:54 Speaker 3: Yeah, and we would be golden yeah.

1:11:57 Speaker 2: Right, yeah, everything looking around us, Look at all the

1:12:00 Speaker 2: stuff we have. This is going to be broadcast through

1:12:03 Speaker 2: the airwaves and you've seen in Australia wherever, and the UK,

1:12:09 Speaker 2: it's going to be all over the like, this will

1:12:12 Speaker 2: be seen globally. Right. We can stop right now and

1:12:18 Speaker 2: we could be good. But we can't humans, we just go, go,

1:12:23 Speaker 2: go go. Why is that? It reminds me of the

1:12:28 Speaker 2: story of the ancient Sumerian tablets. We were created by

1:12:34 Speaker 2: a race of from the sky. They came, not in Aki.

1:12:42 Speaker 2: They created us to mine gold. And I'm not saying

1:12:45 Speaker 2: again take this as just like a bullet point. I'm

1:12:50 Speaker 2: not saying that. I believe it's ay, it is the

1:12:53 Speaker 2: Inachi and we were created to mind gold. But I'm

1:12:56 Speaker 2: saying something like that. I do think it is very

1:13:00 Speaker 2: least yeah, categorically true. Yeah right, And I think the

1:13:03 Speaker 2: Church they were like, no, yeah, no, we can't have this.

1:13:07 Speaker 3: Well, going back to Jordan Naxwell, right, another one of

1:13:10 Speaker 3: his famous sayings of me. I don't know how famous

1:13:12 Speaker 3: it is, but he would he always would say that

1:13:16 Speaker 3: every religious movement is a little political, and every political

1:13:19 Speaker 3: movement is a little religious because you need It's almost

1:13:22 Speaker 3: like you need both of those components. Let me think

1:13:26 Speaker 3: about it, like you know, And I have a lot

1:13:28 Speaker 3: of friends who are Catholic. I thank Connecticut, the Northeast

1:13:30 Speaker 3: is very Catholic past and obviously Irish Catholic and whatnot.

1:13:35 Speaker 3: And I have a lot of a lot of my

1:13:36 Speaker 3: friends are Catholics, and I love going at it with

1:13:39 Speaker 3: Catholics and because I'm like, you know, I really think

1:13:44 Speaker 3: that the true, the true Christians are like the ones

1:13:49 Speaker 3: that are worshiping out of like right next to a bodega. Right.

1:13:53 Speaker 3: We've seen those churches, right, I don't even know what

1:13:55 Speaker 3: denomination that is, but they're like some form of Protestant

1:13:58 Speaker 3: because you know, they're really like, you know, like you

1:14:01 Speaker 3: guys have like these beautiful churches like you need like you.

1:14:06 Speaker 2: Got see that see that skull thing? Yeah we uh,

1:14:10 Speaker 2: I gotta say this because I just thought of it.

1:14:13 Speaker 2: And I can see that she thought of it too.

1:14:15 Speaker 1: Uh.

1:14:19 Speaker 2: We painted that at plaster fun time and there was

1:14:22 Speaker 2: just this church next door. Bro, the whole mall was

1:14:26 Speaker 2: ship Yeah yeah, like they party, right, but yeah, yeah,

1:14:31 Speaker 2: I'm sorry.

1:14:32 Speaker 3: You know, no, no, no no. And you know I've

1:14:35 Speaker 3: been to like Catholic Mass, and you know, I've been

1:14:38 Speaker 3: to Protestant churches and you know, all sorts of denominations.

1:14:41 Speaker 3: I've been to like almost every religious establishment you could

1:14:44 Speaker 3: think of. You know, what's it called Buddhist temple mosques

1:14:49 Speaker 3: and things like that, And I love to dabble in

1:14:52 Speaker 3: all of it. I love to talk to people about

1:14:54 Speaker 3: their their beliefs, their faith and everything. And I have

1:14:56 Speaker 3: a lot of Catholic friends and I love to tease

1:14:57 Speaker 3: them and I say, listen, they're really like you know,

1:15:01 Speaker 3: they're they're the true believers, man. I mean, they don't

1:15:03 Speaker 3: need this like beautiful, elaborate church. You guys need to

1:15:06 Speaker 3: like feel Jesus like they're in this like you know,

1:15:10 Speaker 3: next door to like a bodega. And and they're they're just

1:15:12 Speaker 3: as much in line with Jesus as you guys are

1:15:14 Speaker 3: in this church. Like and you know what I was trying.

1:15:17 Speaker 3: What I'm trying to get at, and this is a

1:15:18 Speaker 3: legitimate criticism of the Catholic Church, is that like they're

1:15:21 Speaker 3: almost like a corporation. They're very hierarchical, right, like you know,

1:15:24 Speaker 3: things come down from the Pope and through the cardinals

1:15:27 Speaker 3: and the bishops. And forgive me if I'm you know,

1:15:29 Speaker 3: not one hundred percent accurate with the way things operate,

1:15:32 Speaker 3: but it is very very hierarchical.

1:15:35 Speaker 2: And that they property that is always.

1:15:38 Speaker 3: A red flag to me because when any time you

1:15:41 Speaker 3: are and they don't pay tax, they don't pay tax. Well,

1:15:44 Speaker 3: I mean there's probably other religious institutions that don't pay tax.

1:15:47 Speaker 3: But the point is this, anytime you create this sort

1:15:49 Speaker 3: of like complex, hierarchical, almost corporate like structure around around

1:15:54 Speaker 3: faith and around you know, uh, like the spirituality, it

1:16:01 Speaker 3: always like raises a red flag for me, like you

1:16:03 Speaker 3: don't need you don't even need to go to church

1:16:05 Speaker 3: to you.

1:16:06 Speaker 2: Know, you are the church, right right? This is what

1:16:11 Speaker 2: was actually said, and and that's again these are the

1:16:14 Speaker 2: things that were taken out of the original translation because

1:16:17 Speaker 2: if everyone knew that, I mean, they say it the

1:16:21 Speaker 2: blood blood of what is it that I'm not com.

1:16:28 Speaker 3: Drink the blood of Christ.

1:16:30 Speaker 2: Drink the blood of Christ and the body of Christ.

1:16:32 Speaker 2: You are the church, right.

1:16:35 Speaker 3: Right, right right right?

1:16:35 Speaker 2: That's now, you know, that's that whole thing is you know,

1:16:39 Speaker 2: a church is is just a place to congregate. It's

1:16:43 Speaker 2: the building you bring in there. So and this could

1:16:51 Speaker 2: be a church, right right.

1:16:52 Speaker 3: That's the point.

1:16:53 Speaker 2: Yeah, So I think that again it's been lost and

1:16:56 Speaker 2: don't get me started. We're here in Boston where oh

1:16:59 Speaker 2: of course, yeah you know what happened, h yeah, what

1:17:01 Speaker 2: got broken open? And if God let that shit fly?

1:17:05 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, And again that's I don't necessarily think that's

1:17:08 Speaker 3: the work of God. I think that's the work of man.

1:17:10 Speaker 3: And I'm very open about this subject. Like, I think

1:17:16 Speaker 3: that the reason that happens is, like, it can't be

1:17:19 Speaker 3: the case that bad people want to become priests at

1:17:22 Speaker 3: that level to the like the amount of like, you know,

1:17:26 Speaker 3: child abuse that has happened within the Catholic Church. So

1:17:30 Speaker 3: you mean to tell me that people that are sex offenders,

1:17:33 Speaker 3: that are predators want to become priests so they can

1:17:36 Speaker 3: have access to children. That's a theory, I guess. But

1:17:38 Speaker 3: you could also be a pastor and have access to children.

1:17:40 Speaker 3: You could also be a I don't know something else,

1:17:43 Speaker 3: a teacher and have access to children. Are we saying that, like,

1:17:46 Speaker 3: you know, oh, there's a problem in academia with teachers,

1:17:49 Speaker 3: you know, molesting children. No, it doesn't happen, of course

1:17:52 Speaker 3: it has, of course. But what I think it is

1:17:54 Speaker 3: is that like these individuals, humans, men, human beings, right,

1:18:00 Speaker 3: not gods, are taking these positions and you know, they're

1:18:04 Speaker 3: not getting married, they're not you know, they're not allowed

1:18:06 Speaker 3: to engage in, you know, sexual activity, and I think

1:18:09 Speaker 3: that's causing them to a switch may flip in their

1:18:14 Speaker 3: head at some point when somebody gets d you know,

1:18:16 Speaker 3: gets removed from their natural state.

1:18:19 Speaker 2: Of same way someone doesn't jail, right.

1:18:22 Speaker 3: And I think that that's what's happening. And I mean, unfortunately,

1:18:26 Speaker 3: you committed the act, you're you've got to pay the consequences.

1:18:28 Speaker 3: But we are the Catholic Church is setting these people

1:18:32 Speaker 3: up for failure really because so few people I think

1:18:35 Speaker 3: can put up with that, like you know, not being

1:18:37 Speaker 3: in that sort of those sort of confines, you know,

1:18:42 Speaker 3: moral and you know, physical confines and all these things.

1:18:47 Speaker 3: And it doesn't happen at the same rate on the

1:18:50 Speaker 3: like the non Catholic side, like with pastors, like in

1:18:53 Speaker 3: other Christian denominations, you don't hear about pastors as much,

1:18:57 Speaker 3: you know, molesting children as as you do with with

1:19:00 Speaker 3: the Catholic priests. Yes, so it's unfortunate. I mean, I know,

1:19:03 Speaker 3: like I said, a lot of my friends are Catholics.

1:19:05 Speaker 3: I you know, I have nothing against them. I you know,

1:19:07 Speaker 3: I love them, you know, equally. But it's it's a

1:19:10 Speaker 3: problem with the institution. And like with so many other things,

1:19:14 Speaker 3: it's always with the system. It's with the institution. You know,

1:19:18 Speaker 3: you put you put a good person in a bad

1:19:20 Speaker 3: situation in bad circumstances, they're gonna they're gonna do bad things.

1:19:24 Speaker 2: Sometimes, absolutely, So after the break, we're gonna take quick,

1:19:30 Speaker 2: uh five minute break. When we get back, I really

1:19:34 Speaker 2: want to start diving into the missing scientists and military

1:19:41 Speaker 2: officials as well. I want to get into a little

1:19:45 Speaker 2: bit of the Epstein file stuff, and then a few

1:19:50 Speaker 2: other things that I will Uh, I'm not going to

1:19:55 Speaker 2: bury the lead here. I'm going to save it as

1:19:57 Speaker 2: a secret. We have a couple of topics to get

1:19:59 Speaker 2: to when we get back. But I have a this

1:20:03 Speaker 2: has already been an amazing conversation, so we'll be We'll

1:20:06 Speaker 2: be right back. You're gonna hear from our sponsor right now.

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1:20:32 Speaker 2: sometimes weeks in advance. So with that being said, we'll

1:20:37 Speaker 2: be right back. Yeah. I was a little bit shocked.

1:20:59 Speaker 2: He was working on something very secret.

1:21:03 Speaker 3: History is real inaccurate.

1:21:05 Speaker 4: What is this saying, Oh, it's technical specifications of the UFO,

1:21:09 Speaker 4: the electrical engineering Israel inaccurate.

1:21:12 Speaker 2: It was a manual how to construct the UFO.

1:21:16 Speaker 3: That original math is accurate.

1:21:19 Speaker 2: It was literally a blueprint.

1:21:22 Speaker 4: These documents were part of the official Soviet program.

1:21:29 Speaker 3: It's legit material.

1:21:32 Speaker 2: People are a little little upset that this book is

1:21:34 Speaker 2: out there.

1:21:35 Speaker 4: This was dangerous form to put it out.

1:21:37 Speaker 2: The people that it seemed to benefit the most were

1:21:41 Speaker 2: the ones pushing back the hardest, which raised a really

1:21:45 Speaker 2: big alarm bell for me.

1:21:47 Speaker 4: Logic and reason would tell me they shouldn't match anything.

1:21:53 Speaker 3: Technology he describes is not twenty first centuries like twenty

1:21:56 Speaker 3: second centurists.

1:21:57 Speaker 4: And all of the science points tore into the United

1:22:03 Speaker 4: States government.

1:22:04 Speaker 2: You think that that would be something that they want,

1:22:07 Speaker 2: because the people deserve to know the truth.

1:22:10 Speaker 4: There's things in there that can change humanity.

1:22:13 Speaker 2: I don't think they really want to see any change.

1:22:17 Speaker 2: He didn't have to fight anymore because other people fighting

1:22:20 Speaker 2: for him. The future doesn't belong in classified vaults. Back

1:22:43 Speaker 2: here at Total Disclosure TDP Studios in Boston. My guest,

1:22:48 Speaker 2: Joe Hawk's a state representative in Connecticut passed a very

1:22:56 Speaker 2: very very pretty remarkable bill bipartisan. You know, we kind

1:23:03 Speaker 2: of went through all that. Now I'm like kind of

1:23:06 Speaker 2: broaden our horizons here a little bit if you don't mind.

1:23:09 Speaker 3: No, of course, have.

1:23:11 Speaker 2: You been keeping track of some of the headlines regarding

1:23:17 Speaker 2: these missing scientists, missing generals, and just missing people that

1:23:23 Speaker 2: have ties or worked close to black programs, to nuclear

1:23:32 Speaker 2: aerospace and all those sectors.

1:23:35 Speaker 3: Have you been Yeah? Yeah, no I have, And I'm

1:23:39 Speaker 3: looking up at your screen right.

1:23:40 Speaker 2: Here, and so we have about ten of those.

1:23:43 Speaker 3: Ten right now. Yeah, and it spans a couple of years,

1:23:46 Speaker 3: I think.

1:23:46 Speaker 2: Yeah, because we could even start with Amy Eskridge. Okay,

1:23:51 Speaker 2: So she who was working on breakthrough technology, break through

1:23:57 Speaker 2: aerospace technology and propulsion technolog found dead. Right this is

1:24:04 Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, and now we're at twenty twenty six

1:24:10 Speaker 2: for you, and you know, Amy's case is very very odd.

1:24:15 Speaker 2: I implore you to look into it. Can you What

1:24:18 Speaker 2: do we have for Amy? She was again working in

1:24:23 Speaker 2: the aerospace and like the she she had a top

1:24:27 Speaker 2: secret clearance. She had warned on streams and on different

1:24:34 Speaker 2: podcasts that she felt she was in danger and then

1:24:38 Speaker 2: she gets found unalived and under you know, some odd

1:24:45 Speaker 2: circumstances we have to play the video or anything. But

1:24:48 Speaker 2: she was doing you know a bunch of these kind

1:24:50 Speaker 2: of streams with people, and she was, you know, talking,

1:24:55 Speaker 2: she was openly talking. So it kind of starts there,

1:25:00 Speaker 2: but then it weaves its way through ends up really

1:25:04 Speaker 2: making headlines with General mccaslan.

1:25:07 Speaker 3: Yeah.

1:25:07 Speaker 2: Right, yeah, So are you familiar with these?

1:25:10 Speaker 3: Yes? Yeah, So the previous podcast that I did, it

1:25:16 Speaker 3: would it was a part I was a part of.

1:25:20 Speaker 3: My segment was a part of the show that covered

1:25:24 Speaker 3: General McCasland. And after watching the podcast I was on

1:25:28 Speaker 3: after it was released, I saw that they were talking

1:25:32 Speaker 3: about General mcaslym and I looked into his case and everything,

1:25:34 Speaker 3: and what's what's interesting to know and what I am

1:25:37 Speaker 3: gonna you know, when I go back home and you know,

1:25:39 Speaker 3: dig into this a little deeper, is I really want

1:25:42 Speaker 3: to make sure that these aren't just because I mean,

1:25:45 Speaker 3: you know, you know, the thing with like statistics and data,

1:25:48 Speaker 3: like you can manipulate it to kind of like drying

1:25:50 Speaker 3: the conclusion you want if you're good enough with manipulating

1:25:53 Speaker 3: that sort of stuff. And I'm not saying that that's

1:25:56 Speaker 3: what this is by any stretch of the imagination. But

1:25:58 Speaker 3: what I wanted to know was is direct connection between

1:26:01 Speaker 3: all these people and one particular project. That's the thing,

1:26:06 Speaker 3: because you know, to say, like even in you know,

1:26:09 Speaker 3: we were talking about the new Bob Lazar documentary.

1:26:12 Speaker 2: You know, have you watched that I have?

1:26:14 Speaker 3: I have, and you know, just one of the like

1:26:16 Speaker 3: not even like directly related to the subject matter. Things

1:26:21 Speaker 3: that I noticed about the documentary was that, like in

1:26:25 Speaker 3: the directory for the company that he worked for, there

1:26:30 Speaker 3: was like three other Lazar's if you like look like

1:26:32 Speaker 3: they cut to like, you know, an image of the director.

1:26:34 Speaker 2: I don't know if that's the Low Alums National exactly.

1:26:37 Speaker 3: Yeah, And there was like a lot of there was

1:26:38 Speaker 3: like three people with like the name Lazarre or like

1:26:41 Speaker 3: Lazarre in the name, which I found interesting. So I

1:26:43 Speaker 3: guess what I'm trying to say is that, you know,

1:26:45 Speaker 3: there's so many people that work in defense X amount

1:26:49 Speaker 3: of them dying a year is bound to happen for

1:26:52 Speaker 3: any reason. What's going to be interesting to see is

1:26:54 Speaker 3: how they were related. And you know, you're talking about

1:26:59 Speaker 3: some pretty high up it shouldn't be hard to find.

1:27:02 Speaker 2: Mccassle and what's interesting about him is the fact that

1:27:06 Speaker 2: he oversaw the budget, the black budget, specifically on a

1:27:10 Speaker 2: lot of this aerospace stuff. And he's working out of

1:27:14 Speaker 2: right pat which you know long Ben rumored in the

1:27:20 Speaker 2: UFO lore to have housed material because that's where our

1:27:26 Speaker 2: uh was it weapons research lab is, so you know,

1:27:30 Speaker 2: where we develop and and you know, make those next

1:27:37 Speaker 2: next generation kind of weaponry project out of there as well,

1:27:44 Speaker 2: which is again and there's allegedly this room on right back,

1:27:49 Speaker 2: they call it the red room or the blue room

1:27:52 Speaker 2: where you know the roswell material is where beings are

1:27:57 Speaker 2: being held.

1:27:58 Speaker 3: So worked out of there and saw some beings.

1:28:03 Speaker 2: Yeah again you know your stuff. So in mccaslan he

1:28:09 Speaker 2: just you know, Trump, Trump says, I'm going to classify

1:28:13 Speaker 2: the UFO files. This guy had been not outed but

1:28:19 Speaker 2: years prior. Remember that Wiki leaks thing where all the

1:28:23 Speaker 2: emails came out for the DNC. In that set of

1:28:27 Speaker 2: emails were emails between McCasland and Blink one eighty two

1:28:33 Speaker 2: star Tom DeLong, who is starting to the Star's academy

1:28:37 Speaker 2: with guys like how put Off, Elisondo, Kate Green, you know,

1:28:43 Speaker 2: former skunk works like the who's who of this that world? Right?

1:28:51 Speaker 2: And you know, you just start to ask questions why

1:28:56 Speaker 2: these people? Why now? And what do they all have

1:29:03 Speaker 2: in common?

1:29:04 Speaker 3: What do they all have in common? Yeah, like you said,

1:29:06 Speaker 3: I think that's the key to on my.

1:29:08 Speaker 2: Current thread is black programs.

1:29:11 Speaker 3: I think that's the current a specific program.

1:29:14 Speaker 2: We can't get that information, right, but at least two

1:29:17 Speaker 2: of the mcaslin and his research assistant or his science assistant.

1:29:22 Speaker 2: She is one of them, so she worked with him

1:29:26 Speaker 2: at his lab and those two are missing. That alone,

1:29:30 Speaker 2: those two warrant some sort of serial activity. So have

1:29:35 Speaker 2: you ever seen the three Body problem?

1:29:37 Speaker 3: No?

1:29:38 Speaker 1: Oh? Man?

1:29:40 Speaker 2: So the three Body problem is this science fiction book

1:29:46 Speaker 2: that was turned into a film into a series, and

1:29:50 Speaker 2: essentially what the storyline is, without getting too deep off

1:29:54 Speaker 2: the course, here is our top scientists in a specific

1:29:58 Speaker 2: field start to go missing. Yeah, okay, and it's some

1:30:01 Speaker 2: alien intelligence that wants to take our planet because theirs

1:30:05 Speaker 2: is dying.

1:30:07 Speaker 3: Okay.

1:30:08 Speaker 2: And again you look at these things like Project mocking

1:30:11 Speaker 2: Bird and all these things where Hollywood's been used as

1:30:17 Speaker 2: kind of a soft disclosure of sorts, right, Uh, to

1:30:22 Speaker 2: soften the blow, you know, normalize ideas before they hit

1:30:26 Speaker 2: the you know, hit the real real world. Yeah, so

1:30:29 Speaker 2: I got to ask, yes, where what is happening right

1:30:33 Speaker 2: now as our top scientists in generals are either they

1:30:38 Speaker 2: know that something's coming and they're scattering and going into hiding,

1:30:44 Speaker 2: and some of them are because some of them are dying,

1:30:48 Speaker 2: or we have some real issue inherently that they're all

1:30:53 Speaker 2: going to disappearing.

1:30:55 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I wish, honestly, I wish I knew

1:30:57 Speaker 3: more about uh, you know, the the series and book

1:31:01 Speaker 3: you're referencing and how it ties into this. It is,

1:31:05 Speaker 3: It is concerning, It is alarming. On my personal like

1:31:08 Speaker 3: Facebook and social media, I share this stuff all the

1:31:10 Speaker 3: time and it gets some level of engagement. But I again,

1:31:15 Speaker 3: going back to what we were you know, talking about

1:31:18 Speaker 3: before in the first you know segment, that is just

1:31:22 Speaker 3: like not really at the forefront of people's attentions yet.

1:31:26 Speaker 3: And I think that, you know, more stuff needs to

1:31:31 Speaker 3: come out from uh, government officials, from people that have

1:31:37 Speaker 3: a huge following, more like concrete stuff like you know,

1:31:41 Speaker 3: we're kind of caught in this loop and of like, oh,

1:31:44 Speaker 3: you know, we keep punting the ball on this in

1:31:47 Speaker 3: one way or another, and it's like and a lot

1:31:49 Speaker 3: of people are guilty of that. It's not one person

1:31:51 Speaker 3: or the other. And it makes you wonder, right, like

1:31:54 Speaker 3: why like why do we keep you alluded to this

1:31:59 Speaker 3: a little a little bit beforehand. It's like with the

1:32:02 Speaker 3: Epstein files, right, like, we're going to release the Epstein files.

1:32:06 Speaker 3: We're going to release the Epstein files, and a lot

1:32:08 Speaker 3: has been released. I'll give Trump a lot of credit.

1:32:11 Speaker 3: Biden didn't release anything. Obama didn't release anything. Bush didn't

1:32:15 Speaker 3: release anything. These files were Clinton didn't release anything. These

1:32:20 Speaker 3: His activity was spanned the course of many presidents, five presidents, right,

1:32:26 Speaker 3: they all could have released something, but it's really you know,

1:32:29 Speaker 3: Trump released more than anyone, but you know, and it's

1:32:33 Speaker 3: but a lot of it is redacted. A lot of

1:32:35 Speaker 3: it is still redacted. And they say that there's still

1:32:38 Speaker 3: some very important documents that can sort of that sort

1:32:41 Speaker 3: of unlock a lot of mysteries that still loom over us.

1:32:46 Speaker 2: What really interests me about Epstein specifically.

1:32:51 Speaker 3: Yeah, I know where you're going with this.

1:32:54 Speaker 2: His interest, Yeah, in theoretical physics, anti gravity, for lack

1:33:02 Speaker 2: of a better term, alternative, alternative propulsions, and his ranch.

1:33:11 Speaker 2: He placed it next to Los Albumos specifically because he

1:33:17 Speaker 2: wanted to target those scientists. Why is a guy like that,

1:33:23 Speaker 2: do you know so intrigued or interested? And for me,

1:33:29 Speaker 2: it's like if if you got a guy that's able,

1:33:33 Speaker 2: if he's the one, can we agree that the president

1:33:35 Speaker 2: is the most influential, powerful, public facing person, public facing, yes, right,

1:33:44 Speaker 2: public facing?

1:33:45 Speaker 3: Right?

1:33:47 Speaker 2: If this is the guy blackmailing that guy who's he

1:33:51 Speaker 2: worked for, that's the deep state? And who's just why

1:33:55 Speaker 2: are we not making this connection that maybe the same

1:33:58 Speaker 2: people that are blackmailing the president are also suppressing this

1:34:03 Speaker 2: kind of technology to keep the general population because they

1:34:08 Speaker 2: see themselves as above us. Clearly with their actions with children,

1:34:14 Speaker 2: with you know, even adult aged people who you know,

1:34:22 Speaker 2: we don't know what the consensus consensual the nature of

1:34:27 Speaker 2: their interactions, but the way that they viewed the common

1:34:32 Speaker 2: person was absolutely.

1:34:35 Speaker 3: Below the right, right, right, yeah, And I mean, you know,

1:34:38 Speaker 3: a lot of this is you know, still exists only

1:34:42 Speaker 3: in the you know, the the land of speculation, so

1:34:44 Speaker 3: to speak. You know, obviously Epstein had blackmail and a

1:34:49 Speaker 3: lot of people, was Trump one of them? Who knows?

1:34:52 Speaker 3: But I mean he's he's dead now, he obviously can't

1:34:54 Speaker 3: speak for himself. Is he Yeah, well that's I was

1:34:57 Speaker 3: going to say, some people think he's.

1:35:00 Speaker 2: Peak guy.

1:35:00 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah right, yeah cameo really similiar.

1:35:04 Speaker 2: People are paying that again, yeah, problem with society, right, yeah,

1:35:09 Speaker 2: people are paying that guy. Yeah cameos. Yeah, overnight he has,

1:35:14 Speaker 2: he grew one hundred thousand followers and I'm like, just

1:35:18 Speaker 2: blew me out of the water with the one day.

1:35:20 Speaker 3: Yeah. It's it's I mean, it's disgusting what you think

1:35:22 Speaker 3: about it, because it's they're obviously paying him to act

1:35:26 Speaker 3: like Epstein, you know, and it's like, you know, you

1:35:29 Speaker 3: see all these and I'm sure you know you get them,

1:35:31 Speaker 3: and I get them, like, you know, these all these

1:35:33 Speaker 3: means with Epstein on on Instagram and TikTok and whatnot,

1:35:36 Speaker 3: and he's kind of getting glorified in some ways, and

1:35:39 Speaker 3: you know, people are sort of you know, pushing this narrative,

1:35:43 Speaker 3: narrative out there that that you know, no one's really

1:35:47 Speaker 3: that upset with what Epstein did because we all kind

1:35:50 Speaker 3: of like wish to, like, you know, have all these

1:35:52 Speaker 3: connections with with you know, rich and famous people, and it's.

1:35:55 Speaker 2: Like I'd be careful there, yeah, because we don't want

1:35:58 Speaker 2: to all be like.

1:35:59 Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, no, I know, but I'm saying

1:36:01 Speaker 3: that there are attempts on social media. Social media is

1:36:05 Speaker 3: being used to push that narrative.

1:36:06 Speaker 2: Dampen. Yeah really, Oh okay, I see what you're saying.

1:36:10 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, To be clear, I'm going what I'm saying

1:36:13 Speaker 3: is to your point of they're using this guy whatever

1:36:16 Speaker 3: his name is, Saint Petersburg Pete or whatever, or Tampa

1:36:19 Speaker 3: Pete whatever, Yeah, palm beach feet. There you go. The

1:36:24 Speaker 3: reason he's famous is because he looks like Epstein, and

1:36:27 Speaker 3: the reason he's on Cambio is because people are requesting

1:36:31 Speaker 3: him to basically act like he's Epstein and give them

1:36:35 Speaker 3: a happy Birthday message. Why would you want to do that?

1:36:37 Speaker 2: This guy is a pedophile, the same the same society

1:36:42 Speaker 2: that allows OnlyFans but then looks down on the women

1:36:49 Speaker 2: that exploit the the the game. And of course we're going,

1:36:53 Speaker 2: you know different. Let me tell you a little story, yeah,

1:36:57 Speaker 2: Dlade Maxwell, Yeah, now, character, very very interesting character. Now

1:37:04 Speaker 2: there is this story that, just like Epstein, Galaine also

1:37:09 Speaker 2: had helpers hands, but she only wanted a specific type

1:37:13 Speaker 2: of person Norwegian. Norwegian like blonde haired, blue eyed, and

1:37:21 Speaker 2: a couple of the guys that were working for her

1:37:23 Speaker 2: had noticed that after they'd like take showers, the hair

1:37:27 Speaker 2: would be missing from the dream. What does that sound like?

1:37:33 Speaker 3: Sounds like, Yeah, sounds.

1:37:37 Speaker 2: Exactly like that. And so again, pardon me for trying

1:37:43 Speaker 2: to see the big picture here, but as bad as

1:37:47 Speaker 2: what Epstein did is, I need, I need to know

1:37:52 Speaker 2: what else that guy was doing, you know what I mean?

1:37:55 Speaker 2: I need And you know, I'm not trying to be

1:37:58 Speaker 2: political about it. I'm not trying to to to to

1:38:01 Speaker 2: keep giving limelight to a guy like that. But what

1:38:05 Speaker 2: he is, there is something there, There's a there there.

1:38:10 Speaker 3: He exposed the dark underbelly of some levels of our society.

1:38:17 Speaker 3: That again what I was getting to before we assumed

1:38:21 Speaker 3: was going on. But now like we have the proof

1:38:24 Speaker 3: to like as clear as day, like a lot of

1:38:28 Speaker 3: these conspiracy theories that were once conspiracy theories about child

1:38:31 Speaker 3: sex rings and elites of all levels, whether political, whether Hollywood,

1:38:37 Speaker 3: whether businessmen, were you know, all these people the theory

1:38:40 Speaker 3: the theories. Former theories were that these people were involved

1:38:43 Speaker 3: in child sex rings and like take ticals, cults and

1:38:47 Speaker 3: child sex rings. And before the release of these documents,

1:38:53 Speaker 3: as imperfect as they've been, the release of them has

1:38:57 Speaker 3: now given a definitive proof that these things exist and

1:38:59 Speaker 3: the they're international, yeah, and that there's they're multi layered

1:39:04 Speaker 3: and that like like you brought up with with Glaine

1:39:07 Speaker 3: Maxwell and her you know, her background and her father

1:39:12 Speaker 3: and and all that stuff, and it's like who was

1:39:15 Speaker 3: who was really Batman? And who was really Rob And

1:39:17 Speaker 3: it's a bad analogy because Batman was a good guy,

1:39:19 Speaker 3: but who was really you know, the lead and who

1:39:22 Speaker 3: was the the henchmen in that relationship between Epstein.

1:39:26 Speaker 2: And who is the agent?

1:39:28 Speaker 3: And maxwel right.

1:39:29 Speaker 2: Exactly, And she's just as much to blame, yeah, her father,

1:39:33 Speaker 2: and then you know the I mean they're the one

1:39:37 Speaker 2: that you know, every textbook has their name on it.

1:39:41 Speaker 2: I've heard of this, Yeah, you know they were. So

1:39:45 Speaker 2: they're putting history into the schools and it's just it's

1:39:50 Speaker 2: bizarre to me when you start looking at all of

1:39:52 Speaker 2: it and you go, wait, what.

1:39:55 Speaker 3: The and these are facts? Like we don't even need

1:39:58 Speaker 3: to have an opinion about these things. They just exist facts, right.

1:40:01 Speaker 2: And you know, again, I apologize, but I.

1:40:05 Speaker 3: Can't absolutely you know, and I have this thing that

1:40:09 Speaker 3: I've started saying because I'm a pretty like outspoken person

1:40:12 Speaker 3: in public, not just in private as well, Like I

1:40:14 Speaker 3: don't really have like a demeanor I switch to when

1:40:17 Speaker 3: I'm like in my job as like a legislator. I

1:40:20 Speaker 3: like say say whatever I want to say, and I

1:40:22 Speaker 3: post whatever I want to post, and I always can

1:40:25 Speaker 3: back up everything I post because I always ask myself

1:40:27 Speaker 3: this question by like, how did we get to the

1:40:31 Speaker 3: point in society that calling out the thing which is

1:40:35 Speaker 3: egregious somehow becomes more egregious than that thing which is egregious, right,

1:40:40 Speaker 3: Like pointing to something and saying Epstein and Gleane Maxwell

1:40:44 Speaker 3: have been abducting children and forcing them to have sex,

1:40:48 Speaker 3: for forcing them to have sex for rich people and

1:40:52 Speaker 3: with rich people, and for their amusement and gratification. And

1:40:56 Speaker 3: oh no, well you can't talk about that's like so

1:40:59 Speaker 3: jarring to even about. Yes, I know it is.

1:41:01 Speaker 2: I'm gonna have to bleep it, yeah, just so it

1:41:04 Speaker 2: doesn't get But that's the problem. I'm don't have to

1:41:07 Speaker 2: bleep this just to get it on YouTube.

1:41:09 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.

1:41:10 Speaker 2: It's crazy. And did you see this? This is kind

1:41:13 Speaker 2: of off topic here, but did you see California's trying

1:41:16 Speaker 2: to pass this? Uh stop? Nick Shirley act they did so,

1:41:20 Speaker 2: and it criminalizes investigative journalism specific It's it's fucking crazy

1:41:29 Speaker 2: to me, yeah, you know, and it makes you want

1:41:31 Speaker 2: what timeline are we on?

1:41:33 Speaker 3: Well and see, And that's the thing I mean. If

1:41:35 Speaker 3: if it looks like a duck, if it quacks like

1:41:36 Speaker 3: a duck, at some point you're gonna have to say, well,

1:41:40 Speaker 3: this is there's probably a strong possibility that this thing

1:41:42 Speaker 3: is a duck. And what I mean by that analogy

1:41:45 Speaker 3: is that like if it smells like corruption, if it

1:41:48 Speaker 3: sounds like corruption, if it looks like a corrupt if

1:41:49 Speaker 3: it looks like corruption, that probably means your government, certain

1:41:53 Speaker 3: you know, elements of your government are acting in a

1:41:55 Speaker 3: corrupt way. Here if you're shutting somebody down like a

1:41:58 Speaker 3: Nick Shurley, who I know very little. I know that

1:42:00 Speaker 3: he was the guy from Minnesota exposing the Somalian daycare

1:42:03 Speaker 3: fraud and stuff, and it's like, Okay, he exposed something

1:42:06 Speaker 3: that was a crime, you know. And it's like if

1:42:09 Speaker 3: he's going around and he's exposing he's trying to expose

1:42:12 Speaker 3: things and he and he falls flat, and it's he's

1:42:16 Speaker 3: going after something where there's no there there, then that

1:42:20 Speaker 3: will also come to the light and people will say,

1:42:23 Speaker 3: well he was wrong there he went after something or

1:42:26 Speaker 3: some people or whatever that were innocent. So you know, he.

1:42:30 Speaker 2: Still protected by a second Amendment. Right, first Amendment firm right, Sorry.

1:42:35 Speaker 3: He may use the second Amendment to protect his first Amendment.

1:42:40 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, where's your mind?

1:42:43 Speaker 2: Uh no, So and you know, shout by the way,

1:42:47 Speaker 2: shut out Nick Suarly, keep doing what you're doing, kid, Yeah,

1:42:50 Speaker 2: twenty one.

1:42:52 Speaker 3: He looks than that.

1:42:53 Speaker 2: Twenty one. How are you kidding me? The change that

1:42:57 Speaker 2: could be brought But and you know what, he's exposed again.

1:43:02 Speaker 2: I always had this like full circle when I bring

1:43:04 Speaker 2: something up, because if he's able to find billions in

1:43:08 Speaker 2: waste rodden abuse. Yeah, you don't think that the the

1:43:13 Speaker 2: black programs, Lockey Martin, that they're that they're not also

1:43:17 Speaker 2: charging eight hundred dollars for a nail.

1:43:19 Speaker 3: Yeah, yoh yeah. That stuff was time ago. There was

1:43:23 Speaker 3: actually a famous case. I mean you may vaguely remember

1:43:26 Speaker 3: this because we were around the same age during like

1:43:31 Speaker 3: there was some sort of like audit done during the

1:43:34 Speaker 3: either Afghanistan or Iraq war, and there was like a

1:43:37 Speaker 3: company that was like selling like the Department of Defense,

1:43:40 Speaker 3: like special washers for like one hundred thousand dollars weeks,

1:43:44 Speaker 3: like a washer, right, Like I don't know how special

1:43:47 Speaker 3: a washer can get. Maybe it was made out of

1:43:49 Speaker 3: like element one, I don't know, but for like one

1:43:53 Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars apiece, and like they were getting away

1:43:56 Speaker 3: with it for really long until they finally got busted.

1:43:58 Speaker 3: And it's like, I'm sure there's of those types of stories,

1:44:01 Speaker 3: and you know, and that's not the sort of like

1:44:04 Speaker 3: fraud that Nick Sureley's going after per se. But like,

1:44:06 Speaker 3: you know, I'll even give you an example with Connecticut,

1:44:08 Speaker 3: and this isn't technically fraud, but like in the budget

1:44:11 Speaker 3: there's you know, we're all familiar with the term pork

1:44:13 Speaker 3: spending or pork barrels spending where you know exactly we'll

1:44:19 Speaker 3: throw off sorts of you know, stuff for their districts

1:44:22 Speaker 3: in a budget. In Connecticut, we call those rats you

1:44:25 Speaker 3: know whatever I more fitting term, actually I think it

1:44:28 Speaker 3: sure is. And you know, you'll look at all these

1:44:31 Speaker 3: things and individually they're anywhere between two hundred thousand to

1:44:36 Speaker 3: a million dollars, but when you have hundreds of them,

1:44:39 Speaker 3: they add up, especially in a small state like Connecticut,

1:44:41 Speaker 3: and we we have a lot of money. We're a

1:44:43 Speaker 3: rich state parts of the state.

1:44:45 Speaker 2: But you're now fighting that because you're like, oh, wait,

1:44:50 Speaker 2: where is all the money?

1:44:51 Speaker 3: Yeah, but here, and let me give you some examples.

1:44:53 Speaker 3: So look, this is how ridiculous it is, and you're

1:44:55 Speaker 3: it's gonna be really hard to believe. But if you

1:44:57 Speaker 3: look at our last budget that we passed in there

1:45:01 Speaker 3: there is money for a club known as Jeep Owners

1:45:05 Speaker 3: of America, like literally a recreational club, like a club

1:45:10 Speaker 3: of Jeep enthusiasts are getting state or getting taxpayer dollars.

1:45:15 Speaker 3: There's ethnic based organizations Indian Americans, Indian Americans, Bengali Americans. Uh,

1:45:25 Speaker 3: you know, all sorts of things, wonderful people. I love

1:45:27 Speaker 3: the I love the Indians, I love the Bengalis. But

1:45:30 Speaker 3: you shouldn't be getting taxpayer dollars to throw your festivals.

1:45:34 Speaker 3: You raise the money, raise the money, and throw your

1:45:36 Speaker 3: festivals like everybody else does. Literally, but these are but

1:45:39 Speaker 3: you could track it. You could you could see who

1:45:42 Speaker 3: is advocating for certain groups, all sorts of LGBT groups

1:45:46 Speaker 3: that are getting money, all sorts of ed It's listen,

1:45:49 Speaker 3: all these things can exist, but why are you getting

1:45:52 Speaker 3: taxpayer dollars, and then when you add them all up, Tyler,

1:45:55 Speaker 3: it's all like it's it's like millions of dollars, millions

1:45:59 Speaker 3: and millions of dollars. And that's just the low hanging fruit.

1:46:03 Speaker 3: The stuff that's like ingrained or like webbed in uh,

1:46:07 Speaker 3: you know, other departments and under other builds and things

1:46:11 Speaker 3: like that. That's where the real like juicy end of

1:46:14 Speaker 3: the wasteful spending is. Even if it's not to the

1:46:17 Speaker 3: level of something that would be classified as corruption, it's

1:46:21 Speaker 3: still wasteful spending. And you know this isn't you know,

1:46:24 Speaker 3: the type of place to talk about that. But you know,

1:46:27 Speaker 3: the point is this that we have created this this huge,

1:46:31 Speaker 3: like Eisenhower said, military industrial state at the federal Yeah,

1:46:36 Speaker 3: and that it's and it's only gotten bigger and bigger

1:46:40 Speaker 3: and bigger. And here's the thing, and this is the

1:46:43 Speaker 3: thing that I've I've always been been afraid of, but

1:46:45 Speaker 3: I think it's it's happened, you know, even before I've

1:46:50 Speaker 3: i was born. Is that that military industrial state, I

1:46:53 Speaker 3: think has gotten into the private economy, has has gotten

1:46:57 Speaker 3: it's it's nailed into the private economy into national economy.

1:47:02 Speaker 3: Here so far deep that, like, you can't just cut

1:47:06 Speaker 3: it out now, because if you do, then if you

1:47:10 Speaker 3: don't know, like you know, you work you let's say

1:47:13 Speaker 3: you work a factory job and you're just you know,

1:47:15 Speaker 3: a simple you know, assembly line worker. Let's say whatever

1:47:19 Speaker 3: you're making a part that goes into something, well that's

1:47:22 Speaker 3: something maybe bought by another company who then sells it

1:47:25 Speaker 3: to the government, and every it's all interconnected. And if

1:47:29 Speaker 3: you cut the head off of all this money that

1:47:32 Speaker 3: is going into the private sector from the federal government

1:47:35 Speaker 3: for defense spending, you're killing thousands and millions of jobs potentially,

1:47:40 Speaker 3: and then you're the bad guy. And then you're the

1:47:41 Speaker 3: bad guy because you've just caused a massive recession and

1:47:45 Speaker 3: depression maybe you know, and people are losing their jobs

1:47:47 Speaker 3: in the It's almost lost, like there's no way to

1:47:52 Speaker 3: win that that battle. Yet the military industrial complex has

1:47:56 Speaker 3: already won because now, like you said, you're the bad

1:47:59 Speaker 3: guy if you try to do something about it, because

1:48:02 Speaker 3: it will have negative rambifications.

1:48:04 Speaker 2: Right, I gotta ask, Yeah, do you believe Bob Bluzar Uh?

1:48:11 Speaker 3: Yeah, I believe him personally, I believe him. I look

1:48:14 Speaker 3: at him and I've never once seen him. I've never

1:48:18 Speaker 3: really like I'm not gonna pretend to be like an

1:48:20 Speaker 3: expert like body language reader or anything like that, but

1:48:22 Speaker 3: just my gut feeling when I look at somebody's face

1:48:24 Speaker 3: and the way they express themselves. I've never once like

1:48:28 Speaker 3: read any insincerity in his face or in what he's

1:48:32 Speaker 3: saying in a story. Is estates so consistent at least

1:48:34 Speaker 3: that I know of. Maybe somebody has picked up a

1:48:37 Speaker 3: discrepancy here and there. I mean, listen, if you ask

1:48:39 Speaker 3: me to retell my whole how I got into the

1:48:41 Speaker 3: UFO you know field story. There's gonna be some discrepancies obviously,

1:48:46 Speaker 3: but so but he just comes off as a sincere individual.

1:48:49 Speaker 3: And and the fact that if you look at if

1:48:52 Speaker 3: you look at the new UFOD I'm sorry, the new

1:48:55 Speaker 3: S four documentary, it's called S four US as for the.

1:48:58 Speaker 2: Bob Bazar story exactly, Luigi, He's coming on the show.

1:49:05 Speaker 2: So cool, Yeah, he Rogia Gravitz are very very very talented.

1:49:10 Speaker 2: Like so I saw the you know the thing they

1:49:14 Speaker 2: keep referencing in that documentary, like the the VR headset.

1:49:18 Speaker 3: Yes, I put that.

1:49:20 Speaker 2: On and you're in the hangar really wild, and that's

1:49:25 Speaker 2: how this it started. That's all it was going to be.

1:49:29 Speaker 2: And then they were like, oh, no, we need to

1:49:31 Speaker 2: we need to show people because like we we can't

1:49:36 Speaker 2: just like expect everyone to have reality goggles. It was cool,

1:49:40 Speaker 2: but they were like, we need to be able to

1:49:42 Speaker 2: show this to people. This is something next level.

1:49:45 Speaker 3: So yeah, but yeah, get so getting back to that,

1:49:47 Speaker 3: the reason why I believe him. Part of the reason

1:49:50 Speaker 3: why I believe him is in that documentary S four

1:49:55 Speaker 3: they talk about I think it was George Knapp were

1:49:58 Speaker 3: we were just talking about him that he he called.

1:50:01 Speaker 3: He tried to either get los I mean, does lost

1:50:05 Speaker 3: animals even exist anymore? Yeah, yeah, it does. So he

1:50:07 Speaker 3: tried to call like a few different places to see

1:50:10 Speaker 3: if they could give them confirmation that Bob worked there.

1:50:13 Speaker 3: And I think the only place that gave him some

1:50:16 Speaker 3: sort of confirmation was like this like staffing agency who

1:50:20 Speaker 3: said that like gave him some hunters head hunters. Yeah,

1:50:23 Speaker 3: they gave him some sort of confirmation that yes, there

1:50:26 Speaker 3: was a Bob Lazar here and we like referred him

1:50:28 Speaker 3: over to S four or not g g there you go, yes, yes,

1:50:34 Speaker 3: And as far as military, they wouldn't refer him over

1:50:37 Speaker 3: to that, and which is a part of area fifty one,

1:50:40 Speaker 3: right four, So.

1:50:41 Speaker 2: As four as a sector of area fifty one Groom Lake. Yeah,

1:50:46 Speaker 2: but it's up by pat Boost Lake is where S

1:50:49 Speaker 2: four is. Yes, so that's where allegedly he worked, right,

1:50:53 Speaker 2: And I mean, like you said, consistent, consistent really hasn't

1:50:58 Speaker 2: made money off of the UFO topic. You know, people

1:51:03 Speaker 2: will fly him to do the podcast. I don't consider

1:51:06 Speaker 2: that making money. It's like, you know what I mean,

1:51:09 Speaker 2: but this community labels anytime money gets involved, you're a grifter.

1:51:14 Speaker 2: You're a grifter. And it's like, guys, you were throwing

1:51:16 Speaker 2: that word around, just like we throw a whistleblower around, right,

1:51:20 Speaker 2: We like these buzzwords in this community. Right, you can't

1:51:24 Speaker 2: just be a witness, you have to be a whistleblower,

1:51:26 Speaker 2: right right. You can't just be a researcher, you have

1:51:30 Speaker 2: to be the foremost expert.

1:51:32 Speaker 3: Right right, right, exactly, so exactly.

1:51:34 Speaker 2: We love that kind of stuff. But Bob, I get

1:51:37 Speaker 2: that same feeling.

1:51:38 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, And you know, there's been a few documentaries

1:51:41 Speaker 3: that have been made about him, and I've seen all

1:51:43 Speaker 3: of them, and like we were saying, the story stays

1:51:46 Speaker 3: stays pretty consistent, and uh, with this latest one, and

1:51:50 Speaker 3: I found this to be really interesting, and I suppose

1:51:53 Speaker 3: it's something that you know, can be explained or you know,

1:51:56 Speaker 3: if anybody wanted to to sort of doctor this this

1:51:59 Speaker 3: type thing, they could. But at the end of it,

1:52:03 Speaker 3: and you've seen the documentary, they show like where the

1:52:06 Speaker 3: hangars were supposedly, and they did something with the lighting

1:52:10 Speaker 3: and once they like dimmed it down enough, can.

1:52:13 Speaker 2: You bring that up? Look up? Look up S four

1:52:18 Speaker 2: bob Blazar. Uh damn what we look up? It was

1:52:26 Speaker 2: Bob Blazar S four Bob Blazar aerial photos.

1:52:30 Speaker 3: Yes, the hangars and the mountains.

1:52:33 Speaker 2: So what And I'll tell the story. So during COVID,

1:52:38 Speaker 2: someone got no, these aren't no. Yeah, well, well while

1:52:46 Speaker 2: they're pulling that up, you'll see it. It looks like

1:52:49 Speaker 2: a brown grid.

1:52:50 Speaker 3: Yeah. And then when when he did he did something

1:52:52 Speaker 3: with a contrast on the photo and it exposed the

1:52:56 Speaker 3: brown grids the four hangars. Yeah. Keep look, these are

1:53:01 Speaker 3: like maps.

1:53:03 Speaker 2: We're getting there. We're getting there, all right. I don't

1:53:11 Speaker 2: want to waste too much time. I'll overlay it. But

1:53:15 Speaker 2: there's these these pictures that show and when they so

1:53:20 Speaker 2: during COVID, a private pilot got clearance to fly over

1:53:26 Speaker 2: the base, and he had a powerful nikon with him.

1:53:29 Speaker 2: He knew exactly what he was doing, right, and they

1:53:32 Speaker 2: granted him access to fly over the base, and he

1:53:35 Speaker 2: just just picture after picture after picture after picture, and

1:53:41 Speaker 2: you put them all out and then no one ever

1:53:43 Speaker 2: saw anything, right, because it just it's meant to blend

1:53:47 Speaker 2: into the side of my mouth. It's meant to be hidden.

1:53:51 Speaker 2: And they discover all of a sudden that, you know,

1:53:54 Speaker 2: if you adjust the contrast, all of a sudden you

1:53:57 Speaker 2: make out this. You know, six hangars are in the

1:54:00 Speaker 2: first one's bigger, just like Lazar described because that was

1:54:03 Speaker 2: where the sport model was. So it was interesting. And

1:54:07 Speaker 2: then there's all these tracks in Papoos Lake.

1:54:10 Speaker 3: Yeah, I did right too, And they say.

1:54:11 Speaker 2: There's nothing out there, So why are all these tracks

1:54:13 Speaker 2: out there? Why is there one road out to Pappoos

1:54:16 Speaker 2: Lake at dry Lake bed if there's nothing out there,

1:54:19 Speaker 2: you know, So all these questions are raised. Yes, I

1:54:21 Speaker 2: will say, yeah, So you believe Babazar.

1:54:25 Speaker 3: I do. I think I believe him. He comes off

1:54:28 Speaker 3: very sincere. Uh this I think even says at the

1:54:31 Speaker 3: end of the documentary that if he could go back

1:54:33 Speaker 3: and never talk about this, that he would do that,

1:54:36 Speaker 3: and that this has caused nothing but grief to him

1:54:39 Speaker 3: and his wife and his personal life and the and

1:54:43 Speaker 3: the you know. And it's funny like when when you

1:54:44 Speaker 3: look at the things that they like try to like

1:54:46 Speaker 3: smear him on, it's like, you know, no record of

1:54:49 Speaker 3: him here, no record of him there. Listen if you know,

1:54:52 Speaker 3: and I've spoken to government officials at that level, if

1:54:56 Speaker 3: the government wants you erased. We saw what stopp Ellen

1:55:00 Speaker 3: did in the Soviet Union. Why wouldn't the United States

1:55:04 Speaker 3: government have the ability to like remove you from like

1:55:06 Speaker 3: records and schools and things like that, especially pre digital

1:55:10 Speaker 3: age right where it's just only on paper. And paper

1:55:13 Speaker 3: could be our friend and could also be our foe

1:55:15 Speaker 3: fall in the sense that it makes it easier for

1:55:17 Speaker 3: those interested in erasing you, makes it that much easier,

1:55:20 Speaker 3: but also friend because a physical copy of something could

1:55:24 Speaker 3: have been in the possession of anyone, whereas something that

1:55:27 Speaker 3: only exists on the Internet can be deleted, and once

1:55:29 Speaker 3: it's deleted, it's deleted for everyone, unless you've like downloaded

1:55:32 Speaker 3: an image or something like that. But like, and that's

1:55:35 Speaker 3: where like, you know, like he had like a newspaper

1:55:37 Speaker 3: that mentioned him in in you know, the sort of

1:55:41 Speaker 3: like the.

1:55:41 Speaker 2: Employee referred to him as a physicist at Los Alamos

1:55:45 Speaker 2: National Laboratory, and that was the article that Ed Teller

1:55:48 Speaker 2: was reading when he when he ed Teller dies, I'm

1:55:53 Speaker 2: right here, right. Ed Teller was given a speech and

1:55:58 Speaker 2: that's who referred That's who ended up preferring him.

1:56:01 Speaker 3: Oh okay, yeah, yeah, was am I right? Okay?

1:56:05 Speaker 2: Because I'm like, am I crazy?

1:56:06 Speaker 1: It was?

1:56:07 Speaker 2: I'd tell it. I was given the speech, right. But

1:56:09 Speaker 2: that's interesting. Do you have a favorite like UFO.

1:56:11 Speaker 3: Case, favorite UFO case.

1:56:16 Speaker 2: Like one that when you hear you're like, that's it,

1:56:19 Speaker 2: that one happened.

1:56:22 Speaker 3: I don't know if it's my favorite, but it's the

1:56:23 Speaker 3: one that I reference a lot because I always try

1:56:28 Speaker 3: when when I talk about this subject to uh a

1:56:32 Speaker 3: normy right like me? And you were not normy? Yes,

1:56:36 Speaker 3: there are plenty of normies out there. The one that

1:56:39 Speaker 3: I try to use the most, and I've used this

1:56:40 Speaker 3: with with journalists that have called me from the AP,

1:56:43 Speaker 3: journalists that have called me from local publications and things

1:56:46 Speaker 3: like that. I'm like, just look at this one case.

1:56:49 Speaker 3: If you don't believe anything else, but look at this

1:56:51 Speaker 3: one case. Arizona. The Light's Over Phoenix nineteen ninety seven.

1:56:55 Speaker 3: Oh man, look at this one case. You had thousands

1:56:58 Speaker 3: of probably the most widely seen UFO sighting, a single

1:57:02 Speaker 3: UFO sighting ever, twenty seven thousand and thirty thousand people

1:57:06 Speaker 3: witness this, and there's recordings of people like giving their

1:57:10 Speaker 3: you know, eyewitness testimony from all walks of life. And

1:57:14 Speaker 3: then the very next day, the governor of Arizona, Fife Simington,

1:57:18 Speaker 3: gets on stage and has one of his staffers dressed

1:57:20 Speaker 3: up like in an alien costume and try again, trying

1:57:24 Speaker 3: to make a light situation as is common. And then

1:57:29 Speaker 3: ten fifteen years later, guess what he goes. He goes

1:57:33 Speaker 3: on camera and he with James Fox, with James Fox,

1:57:36 Speaker 3: is that who it was? Yep? And he fes that

1:57:39 Speaker 3: fesses up.

1:57:39 Speaker 2: That he saw it.

1:57:41 Speaker 3: He not only did he see it, but the reason

1:57:42 Speaker 3: why he chose to cover it the way he did

1:57:46 Speaker 3: was because he was so stunned at what he saw

1:57:48 Speaker 3: that like his almost like his fight or flight kicked

1:57:51 Speaker 3: in and he was like but not fight or flight,

1:57:53 Speaker 3: like make light of it, or give it, give it,

1:57:56 Speaker 3: you know, life, giving it life would be talk about

1:58:00 Speaker 3: it in a serious way and really tell people how

1:58:03 Speaker 3: you felt, which was that he was astounded the same

1:58:05 Speaker 3: way everybody else was that witnessed this, But he chose

1:58:08 Speaker 3: he's a pilot. He's a pilot, and he was the

1:58:11 Speaker 3: governor of Arizona.

1:58:12 Speaker 2: Yeah, so he was like trained in yah, knowing flight,

1:58:16 Speaker 2: what flew and what didn't.

1:58:17 Speaker 3: He a smart guy.

1:58:20 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like that was a spaceship and people, you know,

1:58:23 Speaker 2: I find that to be that one of the most

1:58:25 Speaker 2: incredible cases.

1:58:26 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, And I just tell people that this is like,

1:58:29 Speaker 3: imagine our governor in Connecticut, Governor Lamont. Yeah that's his name.

1:58:33 Speaker 3: You got. I forgot who you guys have up here,

1:58:34 Speaker 3: but you got Charlie Baker. And imagine him like Michelle,

1:58:40 Speaker 3: it's someone else else, Yeah, forget, but just imagine like

1:58:43 Speaker 3: a like a normal like politician like on the state level,

1:58:46 Speaker 3: doesn't even need to be federal, but somebody important on

1:58:48 Speaker 3: the state level. Like can you actually imagine this? Like

1:58:52 Speaker 3: Trump has an experience, right, and you know he's been

1:58:56 Speaker 3: beating around the bush on this issue. I know we

1:58:58 Speaker 3: have some stuff we're gonna release in this whatever, but

1:59:01 Speaker 3: imagine he one day has a press conference. Yeah, and

1:59:10 Speaker 3: he goes I saw a spaceship or I saw lights,

1:59:14 Speaker 3: I saw a V shaped formation. Nowadays, we've become so desensitized,

1:59:19 Speaker 3: not just because of him, but because of just social

1:59:21 Speaker 3: media and like what we were talking about before, all

1:59:23 Speaker 3: the all the content that exists out there that we like,

1:59:26 Speaker 3: we may see something like that and and may go,

1:59:29 Speaker 3: this is like, uh, shock content, or this is like,

1:59:34 Speaker 3: you know, supposed to be something funny. Like, not everybody

1:59:37 Speaker 3: will have that's that same uh synchronous reaction where uh

1:59:46 Speaker 3: they're all like, what did this guy just say? Like,

1:59:48 Speaker 3: not everybody may have the same reaction.

1:59:50 Speaker 2: Right, visceral guttural exactly.

1:59:53 Speaker 3: Exactly because because because of the the nature of the

1:59:57 Speaker 3: times that we live in that like some people may

1:59:59 Speaker 3: see that it go, oh, he's just trying to be

2:00:00 Speaker 3: funny again, or oh, this is just you know, a joke. Right,

2:00:04 Speaker 3: But back then there was that that didn't really exist.

2:00:06 Speaker 3: There was no there was the real world, There was

2:00:08 Speaker 3: no social media world, right, and you have the governor

2:00:12 Speaker 3: of the state getting on camera and making a joke

2:00:15 Speaker 3: about this. Everybody that didn't see it themselves thought it

2:00:18 Speaker 3: was a joke.

2:00:19 Speaker 2: Yep.

2:00:20 Speaker 3: Then now I forgot when the video came out, I

2:00:24 Speaker 3: think seven years ago or something like that, twenty nineteen,

2:00:27 Speaker 3: twenty eighteen. Maybe he comes out and he says, I

2:00:32 Speaker 3: felt the same way everybody else felt. I was in

2:00:34 Speaker 3: utter shock at what I was witnessing, you know, and

2:00:37 Speaker 3: I'm paraphrasing whatever.

2:00:39 Speaker 2: You know.

2:00:39 Speaker 3: I don't know exactly the words he used. You could

2:00:41 Speaker 3: look it up, but he basically admits to just having

2:00:45 Speaker 3: having felt the same thing everybody else felt when they

2:00:48 Speaker 3: when they saw that. And but that's not what he

2:00:53 Speaker 3: portrayed to the world. And that's that's the part that

2:00:57 Speaker 3: like I think, you know, is is the most uh

2:01:02 Speaker 3: is the most interesting, And even for somebody that's a

2:01:04 Speaker 3: quote unquote ormy, you know, we use that term. You know,

2:01:07 Speaker 3: it's it's sort of lightheartedly. But you show that to somebody,

2:01:11 Speaker 3: and if they're willing to try to digest the point

2:01:13 Speaker 3: you're making, it should it should make them, It should resonate,

2:01:18 Speaker 3: it should make them go holy shit, like yeah, I

2:01:21 Speaker 3: see what you're saying. Like this guy was the governor

2:01:23 Speaker 3: of Arizona, made light of it, and then fest up

2:01:27 Speaker 3: fifteen years later and said that like he actually believed

2:01:30 Speaker 3: it to be what everybody else believed it to be.

2:01:32 Speaker 3: An actual UFO siding.

2:01:33 Speaker 2: Yeah, and not only just he didn't even say UFO.

2:01:36 Speaker 2: He said it's a reship.

2:01:37 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not of.

2:01:39 Speaker 2: This world, like it's a pretty like you know, stern descriptor.

2:01:47 Speaker 3: Yeah, right, yep.

2:01:48 Speaker 2: Uh so yeah that case, that case, I'm in contact

2:01:53 Speaker 2: with doctor Linkatai. She got like the famous footage and pictures.

2:01:58 Speaker 3: Of it, oh in the light.

2:02:00 Speaker 2: Yeah, she made she funded the documentary about it. Yeah.

2:02:04 Speaker 2: So she's a wonderful person. You hope to have her

2:02:07 Speaker 2: on soon. But moving moving forward, you talked earlier about

2:02:13 Speaker 2: Ancient Alien Yeah, now, I know everyone laughs when I

2:02:17 Speaker 2: you know, it's it's almost like comical. I agree to

2:02:22 Speaker 2: like that because we all think of the show, right yeah, yeah, yeah,

2:02:26 Speaker 2: and the show has gone seventeen goddamn seasons, like eighteen

2:02:30 Speaker 2: goddamn you know.

2:02:31 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, so of.

2:02:31 Speaker 2: Course that they've had to stretch, right yeah. Component And

2:02:38 Speaker 2: but do you think it's crazy to think that that

2:02:43 Speaker 2: we've always been in contact with something?

2:02:47 Speaker 3: No, I don't. I don't think it's crazy to think that.

2:02:49 Speaker 3: I and I consider Ancient Aliens the show a very

2:02:54 Speaker 3: credible source of information, because again, it's a show that's

2:03:00 Speaker 3: presenting established findings it has professionals speaking, uh to you know,

2:03:11 Speaker 3: it has professionals speaking on the show about certain things, scientists,

2:03:16 Speaker 3: they're using historical facts and documents. They're just packaging it

2:03:20 Speaker 3: into this thing called Ancient Aliens with some vibrant characters

2:03:24 Speaker 3: that are the hosts. But again, the stuff that they're

2:03:26 Speaker 3: talking about, it's like we were talking about before, just

2:03:28 Speaker 3: because something comes from the Internet, you don't automatically disqualify

2:03:31 Speaker 3: it as oh, that's garbage because the of the Internet,

2:03:33 Speaker 3: because there's everything is on the Internet, the good, the bad,

2:03:35 Speaker 3: or the ugly. Right, So it's like Ancient Aliens is

2:03:38 Speaker 3: absolutely a valid show to get good information on the

2:03:42 Speaker 3: UFO topic because all they're doing is aggregating all these

2:03:47 Speaker 3: you know, cases and documents.

2:03:51 Speaker 2: Even take the show, Take the show and put it aside. Yeah,

2:03:54 Speaker 2: the actual like base theory.

2:03:56 Speaker 3: Yeah, oh right, right, the.

2:03:58 Speaker 2: Actual base theory. Because the problem I have with the

2:04:01 Speaker 2: Engine Aliens that I think they go a little too

2:04:03 Speaker 2: far in saying that like everything's alien, but like things

2:04:08 Speaker 2: like the pyramids, right, the precision, the astronomical, the mathematical,

2:04:15 Speaker 2: like this this idea that that in almost every culture,

2:04:21 Speaker 2: every civilization, they talk about beings that descended from the

2:04:24 Speaker 2: sky and taught them civil civilization essentially agriculture, you know, mathematics, astronomy.

2:04:33 Speaker 2: It seems that we all across the globe we're seeing

2:04:37 Speaker 2: the same thing almost as early as time itself.

2:04:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, exactly. For me, the biggest thing, the biggest

2:04:48 Speaker 3: piece of evidence in my opinion is forget it. When

2:04:53 Speaker 3: I say evidence that it is not like actual footage

2:04:58 Speaker 3: or eyewitness testimony. I'm talking about historical evidence before the

2:05:03 Speaker 3: time of cameras and photographs. The biggest piece of evidence

2:05:07 Speaker 3: for me is the the cave paintings. Yeah, and we're

2:05:14 Speaker 3: talking about paintings that are pre date civilization, like caveman times,

2:05:20 Speaker 3: like when we didn't have like real civilization, and there's

2:05:24 Speaker 3: depictions of flying objects, of people in space suits. And

2:05:30 Speaker 3: then fast forward, you know, thousands of years later, medieval

2:05:35 Speaker 3: paintings of of Christian figures, Jesus himself and.

2:05:41 Speaker 2: Crafts Christ a ufo right off the top of it, exactly.

2:05:46 Speaker 2: And then there's that, I mean a lot of the

2:05:48 Speaker 2: like you said that that that period, the medieval period,

2:05:52 Speaker 2: it was almost like because again the Church at the

2:05:54 Speaker 2: time they're judged jury and execution. Oh yeah, right, So

2:05:58 Speaker 2: art that's the way you can hide what you were

2:06:01 Speaker 2: seeing but also document it right right, Well, yeah it's

2:06:05 Speaker 2: the sun right.

2:06:07 Speaker 3: Right, a star or an angel, but it's like.

2:06:10 Speaker 2: Got this light that's descending on to Jesus as he's

2:06:13 Speaker 2: being baptized.

2:06:15 Speaker 3: And then there's like those drawings where like there's humans

2:06:18 Speaker 3: in like these crafts, these like intricate crafts. Yeah, it's

2:06:21 Speaker 3: not like it's a human and a cloud. You know,

2:06:23 Speaker 3: it's a human in a craft like it's got like

2:06:26 Speaker 3: a steering wheel and it's got like things around it.

2:06:30 Speaker 3: And all these people that try to like you know,

2:06:32 Speaker 3: cope and say that it's clouds or it's something that

2:06:36 Speaker 3: they could you know, wedge into their all pre existing paradigm.

2:06:41 Speaker 3: It's not. It is what it is. And there are

2:06:43 Speaker 3: some pictures where there are clouds and you could say, okay,

2:06:46 Speaker 3: those could be clouds there, but there's ones where they're

2:06:49 Speaker 3: clearly not. And that's the point. Why were people you know,

2:06:52 Speaker 3: thinking to draw these things before anything flu anything flu.

2:06:57 Speaker 2: And like I mean stripped down like a dragon, right,

2:07:01 Speaker 2: strip down a dragon and bring it to the base. Right,

2:07:05 Speaker 2: If you didn't have if we didn't have a word, right,

2:07:08 Speaker 2: if the closest thing we had to flying object was dragon, right,

2:07:16 Speaker 2: That's how they're going to describe them, and a fire

2:07:18 Speaker 2: breathing dragon. What does that sound like to you? Sounds

2:07:22 Speaker 2: like are you a modern day rocket blowing fire out

2:07:27 Speaker 2: the back the dragon? Right? So I think the language

2:07:33 Speaker 2: is particular, and again I think with improper translation, a

2:07:38 Speaker 2: lot can get lost. So that's why I do think

2:07:41 Speaker 2: like some of these tribes that are uncontacted or like

2:07:44 Speaker 2: the Dogons, you know, where they we'll have to have

2:07:49 Speaker 2: another another. Yeah, because I see we're coming up on

2:07:54 Speaker 2: time here. Is there anything I didn't ask you that

2:07:58 Speaker 2: I should have?

2:08:00 Speaker 3: I think we we covered? Uh, we covered.

2:08:05 Speaker 2: What's next?

2:08:06 Speaker 3: Yeah for you?

2:08:09 Speaker 2: And what what do you want to see happen as

2:08:14 Speaker 2: far as disclosure?

2:08:15 Speaker 3: So yeah, that's a good question and one that I

2:08:21 Speaker 3: don't know the answer to. Honestly, I don't know if

2:08:27 Speaker 3: we're ready for disclosure as as a society, as a

2:08:30 Speaker 3: as a racer, you.

2:08:32 Speaker 2: Know, not everyone says that.

2:08:33 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think we are. I mean because I

2:08:35 Speaker 3: have these conversations lightheartedly, not as intense as we've gone

2:08:39 Speaker 3: here obviously with with a lot of people, you know,

2:08:41 Speaker 3: and especially now like people actually come to me, and

2:08:44 Speaker 3: think they come to me from every sort of level

2:08:47 Speaker 3: of this subject, from some pretty intense, you know, perspectives

2:08:54 Speaker 3: like what we've discussed here, to some pretty casual, like

2:08:57 Speaker 3: we said, normy sort of like views on this like

2:08:59 Speaker 3: a little green men, you know. And I just get

2:09:02 Speaker 3: the sense that like very few people can really have

2:09:05 Speaker 3: really grasped the seriousness of the implications of what it

2:09:09 Speaker 3: would mean if we really had disclose to us that

2:09:13 Speaker 3: we are truly not alone, and that the things that

2:09:16 Speaker 3: we've been seeing have actually been other life forms, other

2:09:20 Speaker 3: intelligent life I just I don't feel confident enough that

2:09:23 Speaker 3: we can grasp that, like we literally could have like

2:09:27 Speaker 3: a full on, like panic dystopian level collapse of society.

2:09:32 Speaker 3: I think you think, oh yeah, I don't think that

2:09:35 Speaker 3: we're as humans. I mean, look, look, look how like

2:09:37 Speaker 3: weak we are like in so many respects, Like you know,

2:09:40 Speaker 3: we still fight these wars, and you know, the smallest differences,

2:09:44 Speaker 3: you know, result in conflict. Like really, like to be honest,

2:09:48 Speaker 3: I don't think we're ready. We're not ready if this

2:09:50 Speaker 3: is real, We're not ready as a whole to to

2:09:52 Speaker 3: digest to digest this.

2:09:54 Speaker 2: Honestly, I respect the fact that you're willing to say

2:09:57 Speaker 2: that yeah, and still.

2:09:59 Speaker 3: Willing to pass like you did to pursue it.

2:10:01 Speaker 2: Because most people sit in that chair and they go,

2:10:04 Speaker 2: we're ready because they want us to be ready. It's

2:10:07 Speaker 2: not that we are.

2:10:08 Speaker 3: I want us to be ready to but I don't

2:10:10 Speaker 3: know that we are. But if I could do my

2:10:12 Speaker 3: little part in at least offering a scientific way of

2:10:16 Speaker 3: analyzing whatever we see, and you know, maybe putting some

2:10:20 Speaker 3: people at ease as far as experiences that they may

2:10:24 Speaker 3: have had in Connecticut that can be explained by a

2:10:26 Speaker 3: study of this nature. And if nothing else, like I said,

2:10:32 Speaker 3: just bring more awareness to the topic and show people

2:10:34 Speaker 3: it's being taken seriously by the by the by the government.

2:10:40 Speaker 2: Isn't it funny I mentioned this on the phone to you.

2:10:44 Speaker 2: The enemy of the UFO. Yeah, conspiracy world has always

2:10:48 Speaker 2: been the government. Yeah, but the only way confirmation comes

2:10:55 Speaker 2: is from the government.

2:10:56 Speaker 3: Government.

2:10:56 Speaker 2: It just seems inherently conundrumic got made up a word again.

2:11:02 Speaker 3: Connut canun like like a quagmire.

2:11:06 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's inherently yeah, I because I don't need disclosure.

2:11:13 Speaker 2: I've seen things.

2:11:16 Speaker 3: Yes, you were gonna tell me, I was, Yeah, we'll.

2:11:19 Speaker 2: End it here. So I was young outside throwing a ball,

2:11:27 Speaker 2: waiting for the other kids to get home from school.

2:11:29 Speaker 2: My audience gonna be like, dude, I don't want to

2:11:31 Speaker 2: hear this story again. I look up gun metal, gray craft,

2:11:39 Speaker 2: oscillating moving forward, tree top level, no mistaking what it is.

2:11:44 Speaker 2: I didn't have a write frame of reference for that

2:11:47 Speaker 2: type of craft. I lived to Hanscom Air Force Base

2:11:50 Speaker 2: and I grew up next. You know, during nine to eleven,

2:11:53 Speaker 2: I knew what flew? What did this thing should not.

2:11:55 Speaker 3: Have flown here in Massachusetts?

2:11:57 Speaker 2: Yep, dead silent bill ricka mass right to Hanscom and

2:12:02 Speaker 2: at the time, a raytheon raytheons in that area. So

2:12:07 Speaker 2: I see the craft, I run in. I tell my mom.

2:12:10 Speaker 2: She's like you saw UFO. Brings me to the library

2:12:12 Speaker 2: the next day, YadA, YadA, Yeah, move on life. I

2:12:16 Speaker 2: end up going a different direction, right, I'm not happy

2:12:21 Speaker 2: with that direction. Something's off, you know. Then I get sober,

2:12:26 Speaker 2: things start to clear up a little bit. If she

2:12:29 Speaker 2: would drinking, and you know, my mom passed, but she

2:12:34 Speaker 2: got to see me sober for a couple of years,

2:12:36 Speaker 2: which is you know, for me, that's everything that was that.

2:12:40 Speaker 2: That's the most proud of myself that I've ever been

2:12:44 Speaker 2: is that she got to see it all the way

2:12:46 Speaker 2: through because she was there to during the bad right.

2:12:49 Speaker 2: She was always there and she always remains there. It's weird,

2:12:55 Speaker 2: but I'm in the room with her. I come back

2:13:00 Speaker 2: and I'm not happy with like things. I'm in the

2:13:06 Speaker 2: right place. She's like she knows podcastings like, She's like,

2:13:09 Speaker 2: you found it. What makes you happy? She saw it

2:13:12 Speaker 2: lit me up. But she's like, you'll find the top

2:13:17 Speaker 2: because she knew I wasn't happy with what I was

2:13:19 Speaker 2: talking about right inherently she knew what path I was

2:13:23 Speaker 2: supposed to be honest this one. And so I'm in

2:13:27 Speaker 2: the room when she passes of breast cancer, and man,

2:13:33 Speaker 2: I can't I can't explain it. But just a little

2:13:37 Speaker 2: ball of like you ever looked down a highway on

2:13:40 Speaker 2: a hot day like that discussion fact, so like a

2:13:44 Speaker 2: soft like a ball. But that'side. It's hilarious. The eight

2:13:49 Speaker 2: ball size of that just crosses my field of vision

2:13:55 Speaker 2: and hooks an l. So I saw it. It wasn't

2:13:58 Speaker 2: like something like in my eye that you know you

2:14:00 Speaker 2: have the slowdies. It wasn't one of those because this

2:14:03 Speaker 2: thing turned and then I saw the depth field, like

2:14:07 Speaker 2: you know when something makes it elwick. You can now

2:14:10 Speaker 2: you're seeing it move away, so it's cross and then

2:14:13 Speaker 2: it's moving away and it goes out the window boom up.

2:14:16 Speaker 2: Or at least I lost it outside the window because

2:14:18 Speaker 2: I'm colorblind, and it didn't I don't know, I don't know.

2:14:22 Speaker 2: It didn't admit a color. I'm color blind to a degree,

2:14:26 Speaker 2: so it I just saw it as it looked like

2:14:28 Speaker 2: light bent around it. But my mom was there. She

2:14:35 Speaker 2: was there like just like, you're there. I can see

2:14:37 Speaker 2: that you have a conscious spirit right now, you're in there.

2:14:42 Speaker 2: I watched this thing going by. I look back and

2:14:44 Speaker 2: then my Mom's gone and I close her eyes. I

2:14:49 Speaker 2: never put meaning to it. I didn't talk about it

2:14:52 Speaker 2: for like a year because I thought I was crazy.

2:14:56 Speaker 2: But that day total disclosure was born.

2:15:00 Speaker 3: Yeah. Wow.

2:15:01 Speaker 2: I held her hand and I was like, I will

2:15:03 Speaker 2: find out. I feel like it was her last one

2:15:06 Speaker 2: get on the right track, you know. So she was

2:15:09 Speaker 2: the common denominator in both of my experiences. So it's weird.

2:15:12 Speaker 2: It's like the dichotomy of like what you went through

2:15:15 Speaker 2: that right, not saying your mom just brushed it off.

2:15:19 Speaker 2: My mom almost embraced.

2:15:20 Speaker 3: It, definitely right.

2:15:23 Speaker 2: She handed me Whitley Sreevers communion. She was that girl right.

2:15:27 Speaker 2: Took us to church one time, brought us out. She goes,

2:15:31 Speaker 2: you guys want to go back? We said no, and

2:15:32 Speaker 2: we never went back. She let us go journey. So

2:15:39 Speaker 2: wherever she is, she's the highest picture in the studio

2:15:41 Speaker 2: because she's always always there. Her ashes are up there

2:15:45 Speaker 2: as well, and she's always ready. I've brought her into

2:15:48 Speaker 2: Congress Halls of Congress to watch Ufo pi Wi testify.

2:15:55 Speaker 2: We've done some amazing things together post mortem. And she's

2:15:59 Speaker 2: a She's the life that that guides my She's my

2:16:02 Speaker 2: north star. Where can people find you? Where can people

2:16:08 Speaker 2: keep up with what you doing?

2:16:09 Speaker 3: Oh? Yeah, I mean so you can find me on

2:16:12 Speaker 3: like Facebook, Just just Joe Hawks on Facebook.

2:16:16 Speaker 2: I'll put the links in the description.

2:16:17 Speaker 3: You can email me. I would love to get actually

2:16:19 Speaker 3: emails on my legislative look through my legislative email that way,

2:16:25 Speaker 3: you know, it's like an official Your got to me

2:16:27 Speaker 3: to my official capacity, and I.

2:16:28 Speaker 2: Can use that as and we can put that email out.

2:16:31 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, okay, information, It's Joe dot Hawks at c G, A,

2:16:36 Speaker 3: dot c T, dot gov. So for those international listeners,

2:16:43 Speaker 3: the dot gov makes it like totally legit. Yep. So

2:16:46 Speaker 3: if you know, that's how you know, like I'm actually

2:16:52 Speaker 3: working with in the in the government, in government.

2:16:55 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll put I will put that link.

2:16:57 Speaker 3: In the description. Please send emails.

2:17:01 Speaker 2: Anything coming up that anyone should be aware of.

2:17:04 Speaker 3: So the bill will pass because and I don't want

2:17:08 Speaker 3: to drinx it, but because like I said, it's an

2:17:11 Speaker 3: appropriations bill, it's basically going to get baked into the budget,

2:17:15 Speaker 3: and the budget's going to pass because it's the budget.

2:17:17 Speaker 3: It's how we find fund the government, and so we

2:17:21 Speaker 3: will have this money, we will spend it. So we

2:17:24 Speaker 3: may create a website that will probably definitely create Like

2:17:27 Speaker 3: I'm working with a group called the Disclosure Foundation.

2:17:30 Speaker 2: I am very familiar.

2:17:32 Speaker 3: Oh okay, good, they're out of Connecticut. A couple of

2:17:35 Speaker 3: guys you know, reached out to me and yeah, I

2:17:39 Speaker 3: see that's ironical to mention that. Yeah, so they're gonna

2:17:45 Speaker 3: be taking up a piece of this endeavor, so to speak. Uh,

2:17:49 Speaker 3: So we'll be on social media and everything, you know.

2:17:52 Speaker 3: I'm sure we'll have like a page a website or

2:17:55 Speaker 3: to report anything and to interact with the public. So

2:17:59 Speaker 3: you're you're gonna hear more and I'll send you whatever

2:18:01 Speaker 3: you need to get it out there.

2:18:04 Speaker 2: Well, we'd love, we'd love to have you back. I'd

2:18:08 Speaker 2: love to continue doing this and maybe next time we

2:18:11 Speaker 2: could bring another person, do whatever. But you have an

2:18:15 Speaker 2: open invite, my friend, and thank you. Thank you and

2:18:20 Speaker 2: everyone out there listening or watching. Thank you. We couldn't

2:18:24 Speaker 2: do it without you, and I don't know if I

2:18:27 Speaker 2: would want to. I definitely would actually, but without you guys,

2:18:32 Speaker 2: this wouldn't be possible. Please, if you can like, share, subscribe,

2:18:38 Speaker 2: you already have your phone in your hand, don't be lazy.

2:18:40 Speaker 2: It takes twenty seconds, rate and review on your favorite

2:18:43 Speaker 2: podcast platform. And if you can take a step further

2:18:46 Speaker 2: and join our membership for early and ad free access.

2:18:49 Speaker 2: Thank you so much to producer Jane, to just on

2:18:54 Speaker 2: the keys, and to Lissa doing the background notes. The

2:18:59 Speaker 2: team has been doing doing a great job, and I

2:19:01 Speaker 2: just want to say thank you guys from the bottom

2:19:03 Speaker 2: of my heart. Truly, it's been a it's been a

2:19:06 Speaker 2: process giving up control. I was a one man show

2:19:10 Speaker 2: for years, many years. I have a tough time letting

2:19:14 Speaker 2: go of rains. But yeah, so we've been doing this

2:19:19 Speaker 2: is this is right, but we need to be so thank you.

2:19:27 Speaker 2: We're out, see you guys on the other side.